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Re-powering 1994 Outrage 19 - weight question
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| surfanarchist |
Posted on 07/29/20 - 6:00 AM
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Hi all,
I just bought a 1994 Outrage 19 (18.6 true length) which has the original Yamaha 150 2 stroke. Compression is 90 with little variance on cylinders. It's running great but I want to start planning to re-power. Three months ago I'd have no problem considering what to get - I'd get a E-Tec 150. Well that's not an option now. I've read on various sites about not going over 400 lbs + or - but that puts a lot of motors in the 150 hp category out of reach. I've looked at the Outrage 18 Quick Reference Guide here and motors are as heavy as 522 lbs.
Some of you guys with real world experience with a 1994 era Outrage II, what are your thoughts on what weight I should stay under when re powering my boat. Battery is under the console and I'd loose some weight in the stern going to 4 stroke. I'd like as much motor as my boat can comfortably handle. Mainly used on the Piankatank River and mid to lower Chesapeake Bay. Also pulling some kids on tubes and taking the wife out for sunset rides. I'll rarely have more than 4 adults on board.
Thanks for you thoughts.
R/Wayne
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| biggiefl |
Posted on 07/29/20 - 8:15 AM
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Many people here have repowered their 18/19's with 150 4 strokes. My boat was designed for twins which would be easily 5-600lbs. I am running a 2004 F115 which is over 400lbs plus 2 batteries in the stern. I plan on repowering with a F200-225 and think nothing about the extra weight.
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| Phil T |
Posted on 07/29/20 - 8:19 AM
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The reference article may not include the redesigned Mercury 150 Four stroke.
Include Suzuki in your review. They have a significant price advantage.
Remember, the 1994 Outrage 19 has the closed transom, stern quarter seats and ~500 lbs heavier than the Outrage 18/19.
1992 Outrage 17 I
2019 E-TEC 90, Viper 17 2+
2018 Load Rite Elite 18280096VT |
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| biggiefl |
Posted on 07/29/20 - 10:49 AM
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Is max hp 200 on that model?
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| Joe Kriz |
Posted on 07/29/20 - 11:38 AM
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Phil T wrote:
The reference article may not include the redesigned Mercury 150 Four stroke.
Yes it does. 455 lbs for the 20" shaft model.
https://www.whalercentral.com/article...ticle_id=6
https://www.mercurymarine.com/en/us/e.../75-150hp/
Max HP = 150
https://www.whalercentral.com/userpho...album_id=6
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| surfanarchist |
Posted on 07/29/20 - 12:37 PM
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Nope. The Outrage II (1991 - 1995) 19' has a max of 150. It's a different animal to earlier Outrage as it's heavier, has a transom for just a single outboard.
biggiefl wrote:
Is max hp 200 on that model?
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| JRP |
Posted on 07/30/20 - 3:30 AM
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I own a 1992 19 Outrage II, with a 2.7L V-6 1992 Yamaha 150 2-stroke like yours. (My engine is mounted on a 6” Detwiler set-back bracket as well.)
Our current engines weighs 429 lbs, plus the weight of the oil tank, mounting hardware, and 3-gallons of 2-stroke oil all located in the starboard aft stern locker. So a total of about 455 lbs give or take on the stern.
If you were looking at the V6 G2 Etec 150, that would have been the heaviest possible max-rated HP option for this boat. ANYTHING else will be lighter.
My engine spent nearly all its life in fresh water, still has very good compression, and runs like a top. But when the time comes to repower, I’ll be mounting a 3.0L I4 Merc 150 Fourstroke ProXS. It’s currently the lightest available 150, and is very powerful to boot (HP is in the mid-160s). Dry weight for the 25” shaft is approx 460 lbs, so wet-weight (with crankcase and gearcase oil) should be approx 470 lbs.
Another viable, but maybe not optimal, option would be the Suzuki DF140A. It is quite light at about 405 lbs dry weight. It’s a 2.1L I4, pretty much same engine as their 115. But it doesn’t quite make its cowl rating, and only measures out around 137 HP. Still, that’s a darn good power:weight ratio.
But realize the Merc 150 has nearly 50% more displacement. Pretty sure I would miss that grunt on this boat.
A friend has same boat as us, with the Merc 150 Fourstroke. His performance numbers are impressive, and has an extra 5 mph top speed over me. It sips fuel, doesn’t have 2-stroke exhaust odor, is easy to service, and is QUIET!! There is nothing not to like about it. Plus he gets his stern locker back from the 2-stroke oil tank - - more storage always comes in handy on a small boat!
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19 Outrage II (1992) |
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| surfanarchist |
Posted on 07/30/20 - 5:17 AM
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Thanks! Very helpful. I'd been looking at the Merc and thinking at the advertised weight of 456 lbs, considering I'd be loosing the external oil tank, might be a good choice.
If Evinrude was still making motors (maybe they will be when I'm ready to repower but I doubt it) I would be considering the non-G2 E-TEC 150 HP. I have a 13' BW supersport 1992 with a 2015 30 HP E-TEC and it's just the nicest set up so when I heard Evinrude was out of the game I became curious what would be my options for the Outrage 19.
The person I bought the Outrage from is a neighbor I've known for some years, I've watched him over time take meticulous care of this boat and motor. Knowing how he's maintained it is the reason I bought a boat with a 25 YO motor. I expect the old Yamaha to continue to deliver for some time but I wanted to have an idea where to go motor wise if and when the Yamaha becomes problematic.
JRP wrote:
I own a 1992 19 Outrage II, with a 2.7L V-6 1992 Yamaha 150 2-stroke like yours. (My engine is mounted on a 6” Detwiler set-back bracket as well.)
Our current engines weighs 429 lbs, plus the weight of the oil tank, mounting hardware, and 3-gallons of 2-stroke oil all located in the starboard aft stern locker. So a total of about 455 lbs give or take on the stern.
If you were looking at the V6 G2 Etec 150, that would have been the heaviest possible max-rated HP option for this boat. ANYTHING else will be lighter.
My engine spent nearly all its life in fresh water, still has very good compression, and runs like a top. But when the time comes to repower, I’ll be mounting a 3.0L I4 Merc 150 Fourstroke ProXS. It’s currently the lightest available 150, and is very powerful to boot (HP is in the mid-160s). Dry weight for the 25” shaft is approx 460 lbs, so wet-weight (with crankcase and gearcase oil) should be approx 470 lbs.
Another viable, but maybe not optimal, option would be the Suzuki DF140A. It is quite light at about 405 lbs dry weight. It’s a 2.1L I4, pretty much same engine as their 115. But it doesn’t quite make its cowl rating, and only measures out around 137 HP. Still, that’s a darn good power:weight ratio.
But realize the Merc 150 has nearly 50% more displacement. Pretty sure I would miss that grunt on this boat.
A friend has same boat as us, with the Merc 150 Fourstroke. His performance numbers are impressive, and has an extra 5 mph top speed over me. It sips fuel, doesn’t have 2-stroke exhaust odor, is easy to service, and is QUIET!! There is nothing not to like about it. Plus he gets his stern locker back from the 2-stroke oil tank - - more storage always comes in handy on a small boat!
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| JRP |
Posted on 07/30/20 - 5:53 AM
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I meant to add that I have seen a DF140A on a 19 Outrage II. It was in the water hanging on a mooring, so I did not have the opportunity to speak with the owner. But the waterline was nice and high in the stern sections!
19 Outrage II (1992) |
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| surfanarchist |
Posted on 07/30/20 - 6:38 AM
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Thanks. That's a motor worth considering as well. I'd like to put as much motor on the boat as it can reasonable support. The DF 140A gives a lot of margin being 50 lbs lighter. I friend of mine has the DF115A on his 19' aluminum boat and he's happy with it. His is a much lighter boat. I'm sure the 140 is adequate for the Outrage II but I think it might be a step down in performance from the old Yamaha. I'd love to talk with someone who has that set up on their Outrage. I do like the way the Yamaha pops this boat out of the hole and up on plane. I'm hoping I can maintain that level of performance when I repower.
I do have a substantial T-top which adds weight amidship. Not sure if that would offset some of the weight on the stern
JRP wrote:
I meant to add that I have seen a DF140A on a 19 Outrage II. It was in the water hanging on a mooring, so I did not have the opportunity to speak with the owner. But the waterline was nice and high in the stern sections!
surfanarchist attached the following image:
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| JRP |
Posted on 07/30/20 - 8:14 AM
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surfanarchist wrote:
Thanks. That's a motor worth considering as well. I'd like to put as much motor on the boat as it can reasonable support. The DF 140A gives a lot of margin being 50 lbs lighter. I friend of mine has the DF115A on his 19' aluminum boat and he's happy with it. His is a much lighter boat. I'm sure the 140 is adequate for the Outrage II but I think it might be a step down in performance from the old Yamaha. I'd love to talk with someone who has that set up on their Outrage. I do like the way the Yamaha pops this boat out of the hole and up on plane. I'm hoping I can maintain that level of performance when I repower.
I do have a substantial T-top which adds weight amidship. Not sure if that would offset some of the weight on the stern
If you go with the Merc 150, based on how my friend’s boat performs, you’ll have performance that exceeds our Yamahas.
Boat looks sharp. Nice T-Top. That weight is pretty close to amidships, so I’m not sure it will offset stern weight much or at all, though.
BTW, my buddy and I are also in VA, but up the Potomac River near DC.
19 Outrage II (1992) |
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| surfanarchist |
Posted on 07/30/20 - 8:24 AM
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I'm in Alexandria but have a place (and my boat) down in Gloucester County. My Outrage is from up here in Alexandria and has only been run on the Potomac just like yours.
JRP wrote:
surfanarchist wrote:
Thanks. That's a motor worth considering as well. I'd like to put as much motor on the boat as it can reasonable support. The DF 140A gives a lot of margin being 50 lbs lighter. I friend of mine has the DF115A on his 19' aluminum boat and he's happy with it. His is a much lighter boat. I'm sure the 140 is adequate for the Outrage II but I think it might be a step down in performance from the old Yamaha. I'd love to talk with someone who has that set up on their Outrage. I do like the way the Yamaha pops this boat out of the hole and up on plane. I'm hoping I can maintain that level of performance when I repower.
I do have a substantial T-top which adds weight amidship. Not sure if that would offset some of the weight on the stern
If you go with the Merc 150, based on how my friend’s boat performs, you’ll have performance that exceeds our Yamahas.
Boat looks sharp. Nice T-Top. That weight is pretty close to amidships, so I’m not sure it will offset stern weight much or at all, though.
BTW, my buddy and I are also in VA, but up the Potomac River near DC.
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| captkern |
Posted on 08/01/20 - 1:03 PM
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Hello, I have a 1993 Outrage 19 and went from a 150 Yamaha original to a 115 e tec GI. The 115 does a great job. It was lighter and propped rite works fine.
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| JRP |
Posted on 08/02/20 - 5:37 AM
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captkern wrote:
Hello, I have a 1993 Outrage 19 and went from a 150 Yamaha original to a 115 e tec GI. The 115 does a great job. It was lighter and propped rite works fine.
That’s an interesting choice. Any chance you could share performance numbers with us?
Does that engine have a remote oil reservoir, or is it on the engine itself?
19 Outrage II (1992) |
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| captkern |
Posted on 08/02/20 - 6:14 PM
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With about 60 gls fuel, two people, and lots of fishing stuff, the boat does 23-25 MPH at 4300. It tops out at 5500 and 33MPH.
Oil Tank is remote.
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| biggiefl |
Posted on 08/03/20 - 10:53 AM
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That hull must be much heavier. My 1986 Outrage 18 with a 2004 F115 with same load does about 40 on the nose.
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| Phil T |
Posted on 08/03/20 - 11:17 AM
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Nick - See post #3.
The hull is 500 lbs heavier due to the added liner, console, molded leaning post and rear cap.
1992 Outrage 17 I
2019 E-TEC 90, Viper 17 2+
2018 Load Rite Elite 18280096VT |
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| JRP |
Posted on 08/03/20 - 2:53 PM
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I prefer the features of the 19 Outrage II, but a nice thing about the classic Outrage 18 is it performs very respectably with a 115. Most folks will want a 150 on the 19 Outrage II version.
19 Outrage II (1992) |
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| biggiefl |
Posted on 08/04/20 - 8:49 AM
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My guess is more than 500lbs in real life. Adding 2 more guys I doubt would drop me 7mph.
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| JRP |
Posted on 08/04/20 - 2:20 PM
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biggiefl wrote:
My guess is more than 500lbs in real life. Adding 2 more guys I doubt would drop me 7mph.
How big are your friends?!?
FYI, spec weight difference is 650 lbs.
Anyway, it’s only a single datapoint, not enough to draw conclusions or inferences. We don’t know anything about his installation or prop choice, or hull history. No basis of comparison other than HP.
I’ve read in many places that the spec hull weight on the Outrage 18 was highly optimistic. And I've studied them in person and in many photos, of how they sit on their waterline, and see little discernable difference. I’m certain the 19 Outrage II is heavier than an Outrage 18, but I have my doubts that it’s even 500 lbs.
19 Outrage II (1992) |
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