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1998 175hp Ficht won't start
xyourobob	#1  Posted on 04/08/13 - 11:20 AM
Member Posts: 27 Comments: 0 Joined: 05/31/09	My 1998 175hp Ficht cut out on me last year as I was heading to the boat ramp at an idle last in preparation of Hurricane Sandy. I am not getting spark to the plugs! I determined this by using a timing light as well as using a multi-meter to determine if I am getting juice to the coil when the engine is cranked I checked for codes and none exist? I have bench tested the ignition switch and it's ok My kill switch only turns the key off when pulled so that's a mute point I checked the gap on the gear case sensor - perfect The engine cranks over just fine I began with the voltage supply test and the fuses are all good, I checked the power relay and it tested fine. I am not getting voltage to terminal J on the 14 pin connector of the PDP when in cranking mode, so the book said "test the starting components as described in chapter 3" and it lists the troubleshooting steps for a variety of engine models, I'm not sure what model is mine as I have a ficht and it has it's own section. I did go to the trouble shooting section of the manual and started working my way down the list, I couldn't identify the on/stop relay? Is this in the PDP? I also could not identify the stop circuit, is this part of the kill switch? The only visual clue that I have is signs of heat at the white/red wire at the 4 pin connector on the PDP, I'm hoping that I did not short out my PDP as I only replaced it less than 2 years ago. I'm looking for some advice to narrow down the culprit quickly.
Derwd24	#2  Posted on 04/08/13 - 1:15 PM
Member Posts: 1607 Comments: 9 Joined: 05/09/07	Take a look at the diagram in this link below. Are you getting 12V at Terminal N? http://www.etecownersgroup.com/file?i...?id=596379 Dave - 1983 Outrage 22
Joe Kriz	#3  Posted on 04/08/13 - 1:25 PM
Site Owner Personal Page Personal Album Photo Albums Project Albums Posts: 11447 Comments: 452 Joined: 03/18/05	xyourobob wrote: My kill switch only turns the key off when pulled so that's a mute point While that is basically true, make sure the safety lanyard is in place and turn the key off. This should reset the safety lanyard and then try and start the engine.
xyourobob	#4  Posted on 04/08/13 - 5:13 PM
Member Posts: 27 Comments: 0 Joined: 05/31/09	I am not getting voltage to the N terminal. I tried with the key in the forward position as well as in cranking mode, no voltage. I want to point out that the wire going to terminal N is purple and not red as per the PDP circuit diagram although the wiring diagram in the service manual shows it as purple. I also made sure Lanyard was on correctly and turned key off with it on and still no joy. I had a similar problem last year and after going through the tests to narrow down the problem it ended up being the ignition switch. So, the first thing I did this time around was replace the ignition switch and in doing so I realized a couple of the connectors were loose so I replaced them and tightened the others up. I also found the procedure for bench testing the switch and both the new and old ignition switches are fine, whats another $60.00..lol I hope identifying that the N terminal has no voltage puts me on the scent Edited by xyourobob on 04/08/13 - 5:47 PM
Derwd24	#5  Posted on 04/08/13 - 8:39 PM
Member Posts: 1607 Comments: 9 Joined: 05/09/07	xyourobob wrote: I hope identifying that the N terminal has no voltage puts me on the scent If the rest of the diagram, including the wire functions, is the same even though the color is different, I think you're on the right track. N supplies both J and L through the Stop & Ign. relay, so having no power to N is the same condition as that relay being energized, meaning F is grounded, which disconnects N from J and L and consequently stops the engine. Are you getting 12V on the B terminal of your ignition switch? On a conventional engine, it's usually supplied by a red wire with a violet stripe, and gets its power from the positive terminal of the starter solenoid. There's usually a fuse in the red/violet line located in that area you may want to check. Dave - 1983 Outrage 22
xyourobob	#6  Posted on 04/09/13 - 4:05 AM
Member Posts: 27 Comments: 0 Joined: 05/31/09	Okay, that wire is red with a violet stripe and I do have 12 V going to it
Derwd24	#7  Posted on 04/09/13 - 7:09 AM
Member Posts: 1607 Comments: 9 Joined: 05/09/07	When you trace the purple wire back from terminal N, where does it go? Where do your wiring diagrams show it going, to the ignition switch or the Main Relay as stated in the diagram above? Dave - 1983 Outrage 22
xyourobob	#8  Posted on 04/09/13 - 8:18 AM
Member Posts: 27 Comments: 0 Joined: 05/31/09	The repair manual shows that purple wire going back to the power relay
Derwd24	#9  Posted on 04/09/13 - 9:15 AM
Member Posts: 1607 Comments: 9 Joined: 05/09/07	Can you pull the main power relay and check the resistance of the contacts to make sure they're not burned? And also check the resistance of the internal coil, which should be between 75-100 ohms according to the diagram? Dave - 1983 Outrage 22
xyourobob	#10  Posted on 04/09/13 - 10:11 AM
Member Posts: 27 Comments: 0 Joined: 05/31/09	Sorry I haven't seen any reference to the inner coil? Do you mean checking the OHMs from the gear case sensor? I will pull the power relay tonight and check resistance of the contacts and check the inner coil if I can figure it out...lol
Derwd24	#11  Posted on 04/09/13 - 10:24 AM
Member Posts: 1607 Comments: 9 Joined: 05/09/07	Each relay has an inner coil that when energized, pulls the internal contact and changes the internal connection in the relay. If you take a look at the diagram I posted the link to, in the upper right corner, there's an illustration of the relay. The internal relay coil is connected between terminals 85 and 86 and should have a reading between 70-100 ohms. The normally closed relay contacts (when the coil isn't energized) connects terminals 30 and 87a and should have near zero ohms resistance reading. When the coil is energized, that connection opens, and 30 becomes connected to 87 instead of 87a. While you're there, see if you can also determine if that relay is getting power when the key is on. I don't have a diagram for the power relay so I don't know what pins to check off hand. Dave - 1983 Outrage 22
xyourobob	#12  Posted on 04/09/13 - 10:52 AM
Member Posts: 27 Comments: 0 Joined: 05/31/09	OK, I'm following you now. The four relays in the PDP are identical and I have swapped them around and my tilt still works so I would assume the relays are OK? I'll let you know about the power relay, I did do a test outlined in the manual for the power relay which I mentioned in the first post, I can't remember the exact details but it tested good, I'll revisit it tonight. Thanks for your continued feedback and advice.
Derwd24	#13  Posted on 04/09/13 - 11:24 AM
Member Posts: 1607 Comments: 9 Joined: 05/09/07	Yes, sounds like your PDP relays are OK. I think finding out why there's no power to the terminal N purple wire will be key. If the power relay tests good, focus on the wire(s) that are supposed to supply power to that relay, and specifically to the purple wire. Is there any way you could post the schematic you have? Dave - 1983 Outrage 22
xyourobob	#14  Posted on 04/09/13 - 11:38 AM
Member Posts: 27 Comments: 0 Joined: 05/31/09	Ok, check your private message, I will trace the wire this evening and let you know what I find.
xyourobob	#15  Posted on 04/09/13 - 1:56 PM
Member Posts: 27 Comments: 0 Joined: 05/31/09	OK, when checking for power on the N terminal I was checking the male prong in the PDP. The error of my ways finally occurred to me. The short answer is I am getting power to the N Terminal on the female connector. The purple wire actually has a yellow strip and it feeds from the Voltage Suppressor. Moving forward with power to terminal N :-) I get 12.5 volts with the key in first position and drops to 8.5 volts on when cranking. Edited by xyourobob on 04/09/13 - 2:05 PM