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Overheated Johnson 185
arthureld	#1  Posted on 08/29/07 - 6:09 PM
Member Personal Page Posts: 735 Comments: 7 Joined: 02/15/07	I am pretty sure I got seaweed over my water intakes and over heated my 1984 185 hp Johnson. I was cruising along about 30 mph and my motor bogged down and died. It wouldn't start so I got towed in. Today, I looked at the plugs and they were burnt. I replaced the plugs with some used ones I had. It started and seems to run ok except it won't idle. Is there any chance I didn't fry this thing to death? I'll get new plugs and check the compression next. I have another problem with this motor that may be related. There has been some kind of intake issue with this motor since I got it a few months ago. It boggs down and stalls occationally when I give it the gas. It has been an intermittant problem and seems to go away when I pump the gas a few times.
Derwd24	#2  Posted on 08/30/07 - 9:47 AM
Member Posts: 1607 Comments: 9 Joined: 05/09/07	Your issues sound similar to what I was experiencing in the days before my engine died for good. Not sure what lead to my engine demise but I can't rule out that a carb had issues and the cylinder was running too lean on fuel and lube. I was crusing along just like you were at about the same speed when it died. It sounds like your engine isn't badly damaged, but you want to prevent any further damage if there's an issue like a bad carb causing your problems. At the minimum, I'd suggest a compression test before you go any further as it sounds like you have previous recent numbers for comparison? You could also pull the heads and take a visual look for any scoring... Once you've determined the shape of the cylinders, you can move on to the front end. I was also reading about a technique that didn't require carb tear down to refurbish that I was going to try, but didn't have the chance. Give it a read here, the procedure that Jeff describes is exactly what I was going to follow: http://www.whalercentral.com/forum/vi...ad_id=2212
arthureld	#3  Posted on 08/30/07 - 10:35 AM
Member Personal Page Posts: 735 Comments: 7 Joined: 02/15/07	Thanks for the reply Derwd24. I'm having someone look at the motor this afternoon or tomorrow. Maybe they can get it running. I wanted to play on my boat this weekend. So, what did you decide to do about your motor?
Derwd24	#4  Posted on 08/30/07 - 3:29 PM
Member Posts: 1607 Comments: 9 Joined: 05/09/07	I've pretty much decided not to rebuild my motor and am going to go new or relatively new depending on what turns up, timing, etc. Looking into the best one for my use now, but I don't think I'll be back on the water this season unfortunately. Keep us posted on what you find out. Hopefully you'll be able to at least get out this weekend!
jlh49	#5  Posted on 08/30/07 - 3:36 PM
Member Personal Page Posts: 92 Comments: 1 Joined: 02/25/07	Be sure to have the stator checked out. There was a period when heat was a problem for stators in OMC engines. Jack Harley 1989 Outrage 22' 2005 Yamaha F150
arthureld	#6  Posted on 08/30/07 - 4:08 PM
Member Personal Page Posts: 735 Comments: 7 Joined: 02/15/07	I'm still going back and forth about what to do. I know some people around that might rebuild mine fairly cheap. And I saw a used 1987 200 hp Johnson for $2000. It's from a reputable dealer so that doesn't sound too bad either. Then I have that E-tec eating away at me. The 200 hp only weighs 427 lbs. Same as the 150 or 175. I have a feeling it would get my Outrage 20 up to about 60 mph. That's a scarey thought. The guy I have coming over to look at my motor is a very pleasent guy to work with. He has done some other work on my boat too. If he recommends a rebuild and he doesn't want too much, I'll probably just do the rebuild.
kamie	#7  Posted on 08/30/07 - 5:43 PM
Member Personal Page Project Albums Posts: 2975 Comments: 3 Joined: 11/04/05	Sometimes the rebuild is the way to go, just depends on if you can afford new and plan to keep the boat long enough to make it worth it. I could have dropped a new powerhead on my merc but that was going to cost me 3 to 4k and the rest of the parts would have been 12 years old with unknow history. I choose to go new, mainly because I plan to keep the 18 for a long while. If I though I was going to want to sell in the next couple years and move up, I would have gotten a good used outboard to get by. good luck
joninnj	#8  Posted on 08/30/07 - 5:49 PM
Member Personal Page Posts: 408 Comments: 3 Joined: 06/07/07	Art, It may worth taking a good look at by a reliable tech. A compression test is only part of the story. If it over heated as it sounds, the first thing to go is the head gasket. You may be lucky and only fried the head gasket, maybe also warped heads. These things can be fixed with out too much expense. Even if you have mild scoring you would be OK as long as compression is even. Re build may not be nessesay. But if compression is not even it will not idle... Then a rebuild... You won't know this until you pull the heads. Good luck Edited by joninnj on 08/30/07 - 5:51 PM Jon in NJ Many other boats and outboards in my boating history The Whaler is the one I like the best!!!
arthureld	#9  Posted on 08/30/07 - 6:51 PM
Member Personal Page Posts: 735 Comments: 7 Joined: 02/15/07	You guys rock. It's great to have people to talk to that have made these decisions before. Kamie, my boat is in very good shape and it fits my purpose well. I'd love a E-tec with all the bells and whistles. I want guages that tell me important info about my motor and alarms that tell me if something is wrong. The only guage I have now it a tachometer. But I bet all the rigging, wiring and gauges cost quite a bit on top of that expensive motor. It will cost more for a new motor than I paid for my boat, motor, and new trailer. Decisions, decisions.....
Joe Kriz	#10  Posted on 08/30/07 - 7:21 PM
Site Owner Personal Page Personal Album Photo Albums Project Albums Posts: 11447 Comments: 452 Joined: 03/18/05	Roger, An E-Tec 150hp runs about $11k to $12k (approximately) You can buy the System Check engine harness on eBay for $70 new.... You do NOT need new engine controls or key switch as you can buy an adapter. However, a new key switch would be nice unless yours is already new. Gauges..... You need them anyway.... keep looking on eBay for new.... I recommend these Tech Series Gauges: 1. System Check Tachometer - 176301 2. Voltmeter - 174687 3. Trim Gauge - 174679 4. Hour Meter - 174688 I just put all new OMC Tech Series gauges in my Outrage 18' in anticipation of a new E-Tec. These gauges still work on the old motors with a modification to the System Check Tachometer wiring plug. http://www.whalercentral.com/readarti...icle_id=72 You do not really need a speedometer. I only put one in because I already had the 3 3/8" hole. Usually your fishfinder or GPS will give you your speed. Question: When your engine overheated, did the alarm sound? If not, read this article: http://www.whalercentral.com/readarti...ticle_id=9 Edited by Joe Kriz on 08/30/07 - 7:26 PM
Derwd24	#11  Posted on 08/30/07 - 10:13 PM
Member Posts: 1607 Comments: 9 Joined: 05/09/07	It is a tough decision for sure! But the question of how long you'd like to keep the boat is key, as Kami says. The thing that's a big factor for me is it's a pretty short boating season up here, as you well know. I really look forward to it all winter long, and the thought of possibly being sidelined again next season with rebuilt or older used engine problems, coupled with the fact that I plan on keeping the boat a while, is enough for me to be looking new.
arthureld	#12  Posted on 08/31/07 - 12:43 AM
Member Personal Page Posts: 735 Comments: 7 Joined: 02/15/07	Derwd24, I'm not ready to stop for the season Derwd24. I don't think my canal freezes enough to stop me from getting through. I will give it a short rest this winter, but I doubt it will be more than 3 months. I have clothing for extream cold and I want to go fishing. Thanks for all the great info Joe. I never heard an alarm. I suspect mine doesn't work. My motor was very hot. It was smoking and stinking. I assume I seazed at least one piston. I will know more tomorrow. My Outrage 20 is rated for 180 hp Joe. Wouldn't a 175 E-tec be the right choice for me? Or, maybe a 200 since they all weigh the same. I can't imagine doing WOT prop testing with any of those motors though.
blakesanborn	#13  Posted on 08/31/07 - 2:19 AM
Member Personal Page Posts: 82 Comments: 2 Joined: 05/29/07	Think about the Suzuki engine. From what I have heard they are really dependable and cheaper. Just a thought.
MWH	#14  Posted on 08/31/07 - 5:31 AM
Member Personal Page Project Albums Posts: 233 Comments: 2 Joined: 09/30/06	Sounds like you need a good carb cleaning, new plugs and maybe new thermostats? It doesn't cost much to decarb either if a few of the rings are stuck. I suggest you decarb before checking compression. A few struck rings can give a less then accurate compression reading and sometimes can be freed by decarb. The old 2-strokes are very easy to work on and maintain. Keep us posted, I'm curious as to what your mechanic will find. Maybe something minor...Good luck, hopefully its an easy fix those new motors aren't cheap. Edited by MWH on 08/31/07 - 5:34 AM
arthureld	#15  Posted on 08/31/07 - 2:07 PM
Member Personal Page Posts: 735 Comments: 7 Joined: 02/15/07	Well, my mechanic checked out the engine and got it started again. He said one side of the engine is over heating because of either a bad thermostat or some other blockage. But he doesn't want to work on it anymore until next week. I ordered a Clymer manual for my motor, but it hasn't shown up yet. I have no idea how to check the thermostat or check for blockage. If I can't figure something out over the weekend, I'm going to have seatow pull it over to my machanics marina and let him tear into it.
Joe Kriz	#16  Posted on 08/31/07 - 2:20 PM
Site Owner Personal Page Personal Album Photo Albums Project Albums Posts: 11447 Comments: 452 Joined: 03/18/05	arthureld, Have you checked your waring horn system? This is a must do........ http://www.whalercentral.com/readarti...ticle_id=9 When I buy a used boat or motor, there are several things I do before I use it. 1. Put in a new water pump impeller... 2. Put in new thermostat(s) and gaskets... 3. Check the warning horn system which includes the VRO oil tank alarm(s)... 4. Make sure the charging system is charging... Before you take the boat out again, I would suggest checking the waring horn system to make sure ALL of the alarms are working properly....
arthureld	#17  Posted on 08/31/07 - 4:26 PM
Member Personal Page Posts: 735 Comments: 7 Joined: 02/15/07	Thanks for reminding me and everyone else to be sure the warning systems are working properly. Since I am working 70+ hours/week, I will pay my mechanic to be sure everything is connected and working properly. But, I damn well will make sure to check them before I go out again. I'm still going to the Evenrude dealer to check out E-tecs too. I love this boat.
arthureld	#18  Posted on 09/05/07 - 5:16 PM
Member Personal Page Posts: 735 Comments: 7 Joined: 02/15/07	Here's the latest on my motor. I have a bad power pack and 2 bad coils. The compression is only about 80 on all cylinders. That is with the engine cold and it hasn't been started in a week.
Jeff	#19  Posted on 09/05/07 - 5:22 PM
Member Posts: 1987 Comments: 34 Joined: 04/02/05	Your compression numbers should read about the same cold or hot. If it reads different between the two there is an issue. 80 psi is 20 below what would be considered rebuild time. She's a tired old (sea)horse. Edited by Jeff on 09/05/07 - 5:23 PM 1993 23' Walkaround Whaler Drive
arthureld	#20  Posted on 09/05/07 - 5:39 PM
Member Personal Page Posts: 735 Comments: 7 Joined: 02/15/07	Well, I got my Clamer manual in the mail today and I got a call from the outboard place today saying they got my prob back with the new hub. lol I guess I should just give up on this tired old beast and get something dependable.