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Non-resident potentially buying a trailer from FL
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| VA Whaler |
Posted on 07/30/14 - 11:48 AM
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So I'm potentially going to buy a trailer from a Continental dealer in FL. Problem is that I live in VA. According to the dealer I have to pay sales tax on the trailer and I will likely have to pay sales tax in VA as well when I get it titled. I did read from the VA DMV website that:
If you are titling the vehicle in Virginia for the first time and you hold a valid assignable title or registration issued in your name by another state, you will not have to pay the sales and use tax. However, if you purchased the vehicle within the preceding 12 months, you must provide proof that the sales and use tax was paid elsewhere in order to be exempt from sales and use tax in Virginia.
So since I'm not a resident of FL, will they assign a title and registration to me from that state? Probably a very novice question for most of you but I have never bought a car, boat, etc. outside of Virginia.
Thanks!
John
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| gchuba |
Posted on 07/30/14 - 12:16 PM
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John,
The DMV rule speaks for itself. Which state has the less expensive tax? I purchased my boat and trailer from Washington and paid no sales tax for that state. I dealt with CA DMV. The states just want to make sure one or the other gets paid. If Florida is higher, I would guess you could work the system and pay in Virginia and get a temporary moving permit. Do have insurance. My commercial vehicle policy gives me an automatic 30 day coverage to take care of paperwork. It has allowed me to "flip" a few transactions without listing stuff with them.
Garris
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| Phil T |
Posted on 07/30/14 - 12:37 PM
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When I bought my used boat and trailer from a dealer in VA, I did not pay sales tax to VA, I paid it when I registered both in Maine.
I did not register the trailer in VA, rather the dealer gave me a 30 day temporary registration plate to allow me to transport it to my state of residence.
This should be a matter of routine for the trailer dealer. If not, I would be wary of the dealer.
Edited by Phil T on 07/30/14 - 12:38 PM |
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| wing15601 |
Posted on 07/30/14 - 1:00 PM
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I would go to the office in VA where you would register the boat and talk to them. if you buy a trailer from a private individual in FL the tax does not have to be paid till the trailer is registered. A licensed dealer is required by state law to collect sales tax.
Edited by wing15601 on 07/30/14 - 1:10 PM
I winter in Ft. Myers and summer in St. Joseph, Michigan. It’s now about 12 years since I’ve joined this group. I gave my 1972 whaler to my daughter and sold the 17’. Bought an O’Day 28 sailboat and sailed on Lake Michigan. Yesterday I bought a 2005 130 Sport. |
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| VA Whaler |
Posted on 07/30/14 - 1:54 PM
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OK thanks. I would be buying it from a licensed dealer. I did find some information on Florida's Dept of Revenue site and they said that there is an exception for out of state buyers in that the dealer can only collect the equivalent of VA motor vehicle sales tax which is 4.05%
http://dor.myflorida.com/dor/tips/tip...01-01.html
Section 212.08(10), Florida Statutes (F.S.), allows a partial exemption for a motor vehicle purchased by a resident of another state. The tax imposed is the amount of sales tax that would be imposed by the purchaser's home state if the vehicle were purchased in that state; however, the tax imposed must not exceed the Florida 6% tax rate. The tax collected is Florida tax and must be paid to the Florida Department of Revenue.
The nonresident purchaser is required at the time of sale to complete Form DR-123, Affidavit for Partial Exemption of Motor Vehicle Sold for Licensing in Another State, declaring his or her intent to license the vehicle in his or her home state within 45 days of the date of purchase. If the nonresident purchaser licenses the motor vehicle in his or her home state within 45 days from the date of purchase, there is no requirement that the motor vehicle be removed from this state.
So this trailer is going to be a about $100 less expensive than I expected.
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| wing15601 |
Posted on 07/30/14 - 2:13 PM
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Just be sure you have documentation that you did in fact pay that dealer the VA sales tax.
I winter in Ft. Myers and summer in St. Joseph, Michigan. It’s now about 12 years since I’ve joined this group. I gave my 1972 whaler to my daughter and sold the 17’. Bought an O’Day 28 sailboat and sailed on Lake Michigan. Yesterday I bought a 2005 130 Sport. |
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| VA Whaler |
Posted on 07/30/14 - 2:43 PM
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You bet. Thanks. This may not even work out or one of the dealers I have been working with up here may finally wake up but I went ahead and filled out the DR-123 form.
Out of curiosity does anyone here have anything good or bad to say about Road King trailers?
Thanks again.
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| Silentpardner |
Posted on 08/01/14 - 1:07 PM
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The law you quote above does not apply to a boat trailer. It only applies to MOTOR VEHICLES.
I would not do business with any dealer out of state that tries to use this to claim you have to pay a tax on a boat trailer. I would suspect a scam.
I bought a used trailer in FL in 2011, I paid absolutely no tax. I paid a small fee for a temporary registration (temporary paper license plate) from the state of Florida to get the trailer home, then registered and paid the TX tax when I got it here.
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| wing15601 |
Posted on 08/01/14 - 1:47 PM
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The law quoted above does apply to trailers as per the definition of a motor vehicle by the Florida Department of State which states in part, "Motor Vehicle - An automobile, motorcycle, truck, trailer, semi-trailer, truck tractor and semi-trailer combination, or any other vehicle operated on the roads of this state, used to transport persons or property, and propelled by power other than muscular power. The term includes recreational vehicles, such as motor homes and travel trailers...".
I winter in Ft. Myers and summer in St. Joseph, Michigan. It’s now about 12 years since I’ve joined this group. I gave my 1972 whaler to my daughter and sold the 17’. Bought an O’Day 28 sailboat and sailed on Lake Michigan. Yesterday I bought a 2005 130 Sport. |
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| Silentpardner |
Posted on 08/01/14 - 2:18 PM
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Oh.
I apologize for responding to this thread. I will try to do better in the future.
Edited by Silentpardner on 08/01/14 - 2:42 PM |
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| Binkie |
Posted on 08/02/14 - 9:49 AM
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I bought several used trailers from individuals in Fl. I live there too. There is no way you can get a temp. tag from an individual, so the law allows you to tow it home without any licence tag. No mention was ever made as to how far away home is. I was stopped a couple of times on the way home, it gets to be a nuisance, but I just showed the officer the bill of sale, and I was on my way. BTW don't switch tags,its the same on trailers as on vehicles. You go to jail.
Rich |
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| Finnegan |
Posted on 08/03/14 - 4:29 PM
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As one can tell from looking at my boat albums, I have bought Continental trailers for all of them. It's the only keel roller galvanized trailer I would own.
As for sales tax, no problem. In my case, I paid the Florida sales tax at the dealer, and since my state (IL) is higher, when I registered them up here, I pay the additional only. If your state is less, you only pay that in FL.
I don't know what trailer you're buying, but be sure to order a 3 x 4 tongue upgrade, and specify all 12" rollers.
The SS bolt package is highly recommended, particularly for axles, and springs. I install my own SS roller shafts and Stoltz rollers, using four 3" SS bolts on each set, as it saves money (see photos). For bunks, eliminate the large 2 x 6 x 8', and go for the smaller 2 x 4 x 5' size. It's all that's needed.
For brakes I recommend the Tie Down G-5's, in spite of what they try to sell you. These have the solid SS rotors. Otherwise with vented rotors, you have large brake shop expense when they need to be turned. You can service the G-5's yourself for a fraction of the cost.
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| ShellMoney |
Posted on 08/03/14 - 7:05 PM
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VA Whaler,
your Florida dealer will probably be able to issue a temporary tag, but if not, you can purchase a 3-day Trip Permit on the Virginia DMV website.
A Virginia Trip Permit allows an owner or a prospective purchaser to operate an unregistered vehicle from a point of origin to a point of destination, is valid for three days, costs only $5, and can be printed off in Florida before you hit the road.
Go here
https://www.dmv.virginia.gov/dmvnet/trip_permit/intro.asp
Happy Trails and Happy Whaling.
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| Silentpardner |
Posted on 08/03/14 - 8:42 PM
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Remember, every state you travel through may require a permit as well as VA, if you do it this way. Went through that with the Whaler 27 to TX from WI. Oversize permits were required with that boat.
That Whaler 27 was sitting on a trailer that was already currently registered in WI. I had a clear Bill Of Sale and signed state of origin transfer of title and destination application for title with the TPWD.
I also had, and carried with me during transport, the same documentation when I purchased my Outrage on a FL registered trailer. There was no way that any law enforcement agency in any of the states I went through could not see I was just transferring the trailer and boat from place of purchase directly to destination.
I had to get a temporary tag for the trailer in FL, assigned in the brokers name as I recall, and that also documented the point of sale.
I really think this is all I actually needed to avoid incarceration on my trip back home with both these trailers from out of state. I may not have been legal, but I was advised that I was OK legally.
I was not stopped by any law enforcement on either one of these trips cross country.
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| VA Whaler |
Posted on 08/04/14 - 6:05 AM
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Thanks for this additional information folks.
Finnegan, do you have a Continental dealer that you regularly work with who is well versed with setting up classic Whalers along the same lines as yours?
Would you consider yours a drive on or a float on trailer and can you launch at lower water levels? I have read where owners of some roller trailers have difficulty launching at shallow water ramps because their boats are set higher than most.
Thanks!
John
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| Finnegan |
Posted on 08/04/14 - 10:03 AM
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John - Now that I see you have an early model Revenge 22, I would (only) recommend the Continental model galvanized tilt frame series CV-9-4400 in the wider frame version. This is the same trailer you can see under my Ribside 21 (see personal website link) except it has a Vee cross frame configuration. You can launch and retrieve from any water condition, since the boat is winched onto the trailer. It's easy with the keel rollers. Set yours up the same as mine and you will be in good shape. Also be sure to order 14" wheel upgrade. The 3 x 4 tongue upgrade is mandatory also.
Mine have been purchased in the Lauderdale area, since that is where I am in the winter months. But an east coast friend has purchased his Continentals in Jacksonville, a lot less farther to drive. I set my trailers up myself and have yet to see a trailer dealer that would do it the way I want it. Except for adjusting the rollers, winch stand and side support bunks, the trailers come from the factory ready to go.
Set up at the ramp is easy.
1. Using a string install all four roller sets level, in a straight line, as far down as they will go. The keel of the boat is straight, and all weight rests there. Use 4 bolts for each bracket set, with the top bolts resting across the top of the frame. The two bottom bolts go through the holes drilled in the frame. This provides a positive lock and the brackets cannot drop, period.
2. Set each side bunk approximately where they should be. Final adjustment later. This will keep the boat from excessive rocking when you first winch it up on the trailer.
3. with boat on trailer, figure out winch stand set placement. Transom of boat should sit directly over the back keel roller. See my photos.
4. Once boat is set on trailer in the correct front-to-back position, and secure to winch, adjust side bunks to provide lateral stability and for level position.
Done correctly, your boat will launch and retrieve so easily you won't believe it.
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| VA Whaler |
Posted on 08/04/14 - 11:13 AM
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Finnegan, thanks for the detailed information on the galvanized model. I think the dealer in FL and I have been trying to beat a square peg into a round hole using an aluminum model (A-2250).
The galvanized model that I see on their website is a CTV944-72B and it appears to be the biggest in that CTV class.
http://www.continentaltrailers.com/ga...d-tilt.htm
It shows that its rated for a load of 4400 pounds which would work but only a 19' - 20' boat. Is that where the 3x4 tongue upgrade would come into play?
If you don't mind I have a few questions you might be able to help me with.
Did you have to ask for additional cross members to be installed or did that size trailer come with 4 or 5 load bearing cross members?
How many load bearing cross members would you ultimately want underneath a 22' 3" Revenge?
For a boat this size would you go with 4 wheel disk brakes or 2 wheel?
Thanks again!
John
Edited by VA Whaler on 08/04/14 - 12:03 PM |
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| Seamonkey2 |
Posted on 08/04/14 - 5:07 PM
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I think you should call the DMV in Virginia. Sounds logical that you would not have to pay the sales tax twice but those folks are the ones to ask.
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| Finnegan |
Posted on 08/05/14 - 3:08 PM
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John - You have picked the right trailer as you indicate above. Forget the aluminum - not what you want at all.
You won't be able to buy the trailer in FL without 4 wheel disc brakes, but that is what you want anyway. It's a new FL law. With the 14" wheels and brakes, you will get ST 205/75 14' tires and 3700# axles and hubs, which can handle 6000# load, even thought the trailer will still be rated for 4400#. From what I can add up, it's more than enough for your Revenge. A friend in your area has a 22 Outrage cuddy Whaler drive, with twin 150's, a boat heavier than yours, on this exact trailer.
If you are concerned about overall length, check out Continental's specs, and if you want, besides the MANDATORY 3 x 4 upgrade tongue, (standard is 3 x 3) you can have them add another two feet to the tongue, although I don't think it's necessary. Your boat is only a foot longer than my 21 ribside. Check out the way it fits on the trailer. The boat will fit this trailer without trailer frame modification. They only make the frame one way, and the number of cross members will be more than adequate, with two rollers used at each point. The frame is completely all welded, no bolts, and then hot dipped. No squeaks or rattle, and places for rust to begin. Looking at my trailer photos, you will see that the very front roller has to be an 8", rather than a 12".
http://smg.photobucket.com/user/lgolt...6&o=20
I also recommend the vertical guide-ons. They were installed after-market by me, and are by CE Smith. I think I got them from Bass Pro. Look at the next photo, and be sure to add the extra piece of PVC across the trailer frame. This braces the posts and keeps them vertical.
Look for the trailer to cost you around $2800. It's a bargain, believe me.
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| VA Whaler |
Posted on 08/05/14 - 7:06 PM
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Finnegan,
The dealer I'm working with is checking with the factory on the availability of the model. He reported that they remember selling this same model to the dealer in Fort Lauderdale. Get enough sales and they may name this model after you. 
Would the $2800 estimate include the stoltz rollers and other upgrades or just the base model and we start adding options? Either way it sounds like the price will come in much more reasionable than the aluminum model.
Thanks again.
John
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