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Well I finally got my new old V-20 Outrage in the water yesterday for its' first trial run and I'm confused.

They say to not put the plugs in but at the dock my battery boxes were in about an inch of water and of course the bilge and the channel leading to it were flooded. Beings how my battery wires, motor wires, control cables and transducer wire are in that channel, I'm wondering why on earth would one want water in it. Not only that but when I powered up, the water of course rushed to the rear and came up onto the deck a little bit in the back before finally coming up on plane.

Having read quite a bit on this sight I already know this is a common occurrence, I'm just confused as to why I'm supposed to like it. Does any one leave the plugs in?? Seems like the boat would accelerate faster without all the water.

I didn't like the way the bow bounced up and down either even though the lake was like glass. After reading up on that I'm kinda bummed that I might have to install trim tabs to fix it and I'm wondering where I'm going to put my transducer.

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Harry some say only leave the plugs out when moored if there are no bildge pumps on the boat.

I however always leave the plugs in when docked or underway. When moored I leave the pumps on auto and running off of 1 of the 2 battteries.

Also the porposing (bouncing) is a common problem with the 20 outrage. The most effective cure for this is adding a 10" - 12" set back jack plate. Other than that trim tabs will help alot or try and raise your motor mounting up it you have the extra holes to do that.

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Harry,

All boats are equipped differently, even among the same models and sit different in the water.
Some have heavier single engines than others, some have twin engines, some have two batteries in the stern and others have the batterie(s) in the console, etc....

So, it depends on how your particular boat sits in the water.

On my Outrage 18', I have water in the rear sump and rigging tunnel like you do if I leave the plug out. So, I chose to leave the rear sump plug IN and installed an automatic bilge pump there. Now my boat is completely dry even if it rains as the pump always keeps the sump area dry. I never take the plug out until the boat is on the trailer.

On my Outrage 22' Cuddy, I had two rear sumps. One on each side of the stern. I never had to put the plugs in as the boat sat high enough in the water so that water never came in above the drain tubes. If I walked back to the sump area on this boat I could just barely get about a 1/2 inch of water in that sump due to the weight of my body being on that one side of the boat. I did not need any bilge pumps in these two sumps. I did have to have a pump in my rear fishwell as there was no other means of to get the water out as there was no drain or plug for the fishwell in this 1989 model.

So, like Jeff, I would recommend you putting the plug in and installing an automatic bilge pump in the sump area. I like the Rule-Mate 750 or 1100 models. They fit nicely in most sumps.
Rule-Mate Automated Pumps

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Oh My!! I just spent a million bucks replacing the steering and I don't know if it will reach another 10-12 inches. Also I'm googling jack plate and don't see anything bigger than 8" set back so where would one get such a thing?? I'll do some research on what you're saying although beings how I'm mostly retired and all, the idea of spending another 300-700 bucks isn't what I wanted to hear. I still have to buy a kicker and replace the gas tank!!

I bought the boat for diving as well as fishing so I'm thinking maybe 4 or five tanks riding in the bow might help.

By the way, when you did your redo the floor project, I'm curious as to why you didn't pull the tank and do the primer thing on the bottom as well as the top. The reason I ask is I'm thinking I need to replace mine (siphoned water out for 20 minutes) and seeing you skip that part makes me wonder if it's a monster project or something.






Mine has a Honda 130 which my boat guy says is too heavy for the power it brings. I told him he shouldn't be bad mouthing my cool motor but he can't help himself. Says Honda puts more thought into their lawnmowers than they do their outboards. Surely he's mistaken!!

Batteries are obviously in the splash well but I suppose it wouldn't be that big a deal to move them to the console. Might even help the bouncing.


I'm glad to hear I won't be Xed from the club if I put my plugs in. I thought for a minute there I was going to have to be a closet plugger.

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Although I have a different model Whaler than you, I always leave the plug in (15' sport). I keep a "Rule" 500 gph pump in the sump, with a small float switch (not an easy task on a tight sump pit) wired directly up to the battery (in line fuse), it just about fits, I dock my boat and this keeps out the rain water, it sometimes fails (fuse blows from object lodged in pump but, no biggie, she won't sink, and I just replace the fuse after a quick clearing of the pump impeller), the pumps only last about a year or two but, are inexpensive (the float switch is where you get hosed $25). I use crimp connectors to wire it up but, Instead of crimping, I solder the crimp connects, paint with "Liquid Lectric tape", slide "Heat shrink tubing" over it, shrink it, then paint the whole thing in "Liquid letric tape". I have found that this is the best marine connection I can get, and it stays water proof for a long while, I use those tiny wire ties to neaten things up, then I melt them just a tuoch, after cutting off the excess, this prevents sharp edges from the plastic from scratching/cutting your hand, when you stick your hand in the sump, to clear the strainer on the pump, hope this helps !

mw

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Harry,

If you want a jack plate I would HIGHLY recommend the RITE HITE plates.

I know someone using 10" set backs with twins on his 18 Outrage and loves them.

http://www.rmind.com/jackplates.phpplates.php

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Hey I do have extra holes!! About 2 1/2" worth. The anti-ventilation plate bottom is about 1 1/2" below the bottom of the boat and the Honda manual says to mount it such that the plate is the same level as the bottom or slightly higher.

I'm wondering if anyone has any experience as to how much slightly higher I can go. 1"??

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Harry,

I would definitely try raising the engine up 1 hole. Then try it out.
Then try another hole up and see if that helps.

When I bought my Outrage 18', the engine was mounted all the way down.
I raised the engine 1 hole up and the boat has been fine ever since.

When I bought my Outrage 22', the engine was mounted all the way down.
I raised it up 1 hole but it still did not help that much.
So, I raised it up another hole and it was perfect for my boating needs.
I still had one more hole I could have gone up but did not need it.

Give it a try before you spend money on setback brackets or trim tabs.
You can do it yourself or have a friend help you.

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Harry,

Why do you think you are "supposed" to leave the plugs out? Who is "they" that are advising you? Why not take Boston Whaler's advice on the subject and put the plugs in? I leave my stern drain plugs in and have always advised to people to do so with their Whalers as well. Read your owner's manual for more on the subject.

Do NOT install a set back bracket if you are trying to solve a porpoising issue with your 20 footer. Moving an already heavy outboard further aft will only aggravate the problem, not improve the situation.

DO take Joe's advice and raise your motor at least set of bolt holes. A better propeller may also help a great deal.

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I just returned about five minutes ago from running down to the dock to drain the Montauk 170. It rained like hell last night and the boat had about six or seven inches of water in it. I leave the plug in, because I have a theory that a boat full of fresh rainwater on the odd rainstorm is better than all those cables sitting in salt water all the time.

If I replaced stock pump with a Rule 1100 automatic pump, how long would it run in a heavy rain storm before draining the battery to the point where it would no longer start the engine? Anyone know off the top of their head?

Maybe its just easier to run down to the marina and start the engine and drain it...

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I'm sure I read it somewhere on this forum or maybe the Wave. I was under the impression the advise came from Whaler and the boats were meant to be run with the plugs out.

No??

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If I remember correctly (and that could be a really big IF), the Whaler owner's manual for a 22' Outrage with the optional bilge pumps, recommends to leave plugs in. Without the optional pumps, the recommendation is to leave the plugs out. Please feel free to correct me if I am wrong. That being said, I leave the port and starboard plugs out all the time.

If one was to have a lot of weight at the stern of the boat for any length of time, it would be better to have the plugs in. If the stern sumps are full, they overflow into the fish/bait well, until that is full, at which time water will become evident above the deck. This level will stablize eventually, but wet feet would prompt one to turn on the fish well pump.

Doug Vazquez

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Whaler says you *may* leave the plugs out if you want it to self-bail, which you might do if you leave your boat in the water, uncovered in an area of great rainfall. Other than that scenario, leave the plugs in and keep your bilge dry. You do not want to keep your fuel tank in contact with sea water. In spite of what the Whaler owner's manual says, NOT all water drains from the fuel tank cavity.

You will also find that the boat will be quicker to plane without having to drain all that water from the stern sump and as you have noted, you can avoid the water sloshing around back there too.

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I just picked up a Seachoice Model 18261 Scupper valve. Its just a little plastic ring with flapper and gasket. I intend to install it over the submerged outlet of the self-bailing fitting on my Montauk. I know the fitting already on there protrudes out a little, so will have to fashing a thick spacer to make it work, but I am hoping that I can leave the plug out and this will help minimize the accumulation of rainwater with the plug in, and the inclusion of salt water with the plug out, but in either case, help minimize the inch or so of water the Montauk picks up with the plug out, in either case.

Anyone else try this yet?

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I have not owned every model of Whalers but can say without a doubt, that one of the Whalers I owned did NOT need to have the stern sump plugs in the boat at any time.

This model was the 1989 (1990) Outrage 22' Cuddy. I assume that the other 1989 (1990) Outrage 22's were the same except without the Cuddy. This model has two sumps in each stern corner. This model also has two rigging tunnels, one on each side of the boat leading from the sump up to the forward console area.

At rest, the sumps were bone dry without the plugs. The only way I could get water in the sump area was for both my wife and I to go to the stern and stand on the same side of the boat. Doing this, there was about a 1/2 inch of water in the sump which was still below the rigging tunnel waterline.

Therefore, in my opinion, this model does not ever need to have the sump area plugs in.
This is the only model that I owned that I would recommend leaving the plugs OUT....
Like Tom mentions, the rest of the models should have the plugs IN. A good, automatic bilge pump is the best method for removing rain water when docked. However, you would have to check your battery periodically in heavy rainfall areas.

Below is a photo of the stern area of my prior Outrage 22' Cuddy which is identical to Doug's straight Outrage 22'......

You can see the sump covers on each side of the boat. In the center is a livewell/fishwell.
I installed an automatic bilge pump in this fishwell as it originally came with something similar.
The only time the fishwell would get any water in it is if it rained, took on a wave, or, when I washed the boat. There were NO plug(s) in the fishwell so the only way to get water out was to use a bilge pump.

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Just last week picked up and launched a new, loaded, Dauntless 180 with a Merc 150 for my father in law. Its got the self-bailing dry deck, too. Nice.

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Why not put in a "Rule" 500 instead of an 1100 ? It's just to keep out rain water right ? Put another "Heavy" pump in for additional bail out. Leave the rule 500 wired right up to the float swictch w/ waterproof in line fuse, no manual switches. The boat won't sink from rainwater (or any other water), just a thought, REMEMBER "The fastest most efficient type of de-watering device is A SCARED MAN WITH A 5 GALLON BUCKET" !

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Well, here torrential rain is pretty heavy sometimes...but in certain winds the water splashes over the transom as well when the boats tied up at the marina.

I am going to try putting the external flapper valve thingy over the outlet first. Theres no way to pull start this engine, no matter what the manual says. I dont need a dead battery.

I tried push starting the boat last time,,just couldnt get it up to a fast enough speed I guess. Can only push so fast with swim fins..

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Interesting discussion on "plug in, plug out". I have a 1971 21' outrage. When the boat is at the slip the plug is always out. Water never goes above the sump area or more than a foot or two up the tunnel. Under way the plug goes in. I've taken six footers over the stern and as long as I have power the water will run over the transom with no problem. I do have a pump (on a switch) to keep the sump dry when underway. I've seen too many automatic pumps stick on and over heat to the point of catching fire. A friend of mine came real close to losing a 25' outrage under those conditions.

Nice site. Looking forward to gaining some information.

Jim
1971 21' outrage

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Jim,

I have never heard of a bilge pump overheating and causing a fire. I'm not saying it can't happen, but I would take a look at the size of the wiring to this pump and make sure it had an inline fuse like it should have.

A bilge pump is designed to run without any lubrication. The bilge pump is kind of like a house fan, it can run forever without overheating and without having water to lubricate it. If it should fail and overheat, then the fuse or breaker should blow out and cut the power.

Next, I really don't understand why you put the plugs in while underway.
If you don't get any water in the boat when moored at the slip, then you shouldn't get any water in the boat while underway just by leaving the plug out.
When the boat is underway, the brass drain tube creates a venturi effect as the water rushes under the hull. It sucks water out of the boat rather then let water into the boat.
On later models, early 1980's (some models) and above, Boston Whaler started adding a 'Calm Shell' over the brass drain tube(s). This even created more of a venturi effect and sucked any water out of the boat faster than it would without the Clam Shell.

Here is a photo and article on the Boston Whaler Clam Shell that was manufactured by Perko.
http://www.whalercentral.com/photogal...?photo=349

http://www.whalercentral.com/readarti...icle_id=52

You can see these clam shells installed on many models of Whalers.
You can view the 5 holes for the clam shell in an article on this site by Tom W Clark.
http://www.whalercentral.com/readarti...icle_id=42

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obviously your Outrages are dryer at the dock than my Montauk 17. If its sitting still, with the plug out, the seawater will be about an inch or so deep over the deck right at the transom. The 'puddle' reaches right up to the back edge of the gas tank under the seat.

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Canibul,

I owned a Montauk 17 for 15 years and found the same situation as you.
I always had my plug IN on the Montauk.

I installed a Rule-Mate 500 on mine and my buddies, Montauk.
I don't think they make the RM500 anymore but the RM750 is the same physical size.
They fit just perfectly in the sump and have both a manual and automatic position.
Rule-Mate Bilge Pumps

I used the 500 or the 750 in the Montauks because of the 3/4" hose diameter.
I have also used the 750 or the 1100 on the Outrage series Whalers.
The 1100 series uses the larger, 1 1/8" hose so you have to make sure you have enough room to run this size hose.

If you don't have a Whaler switch already on your console like the one in the photo section on this site: http://www.whalercentral.com/photogal...?photo=324

Then you could add a bilge switch from Rule:
Rule Switiches

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Its not the pump that caused the problem, it was the switch. We tend to fish into December and I've seen them freeze up. I installed the pump just for convenience when running. No need to pull the plug. I fish Barnegat inlet and its gets pretty ugly. Its not unusual to take water over the gunnels, stern, or any place for that matter. My boat drains very quickly. There is a hinged door on top of the transom the opens to dump large amounts of water into the motor well and out the transom.

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Not sure I understand the need for both the Auto and Manual, with an Off position switch.

Seems On and Off would do it. If theres water, turning in ON will turn it on, since its sensing water. Should turn itself off. if theres no water, pump would not turn itself on with switch on.

If you dont want to drain battery, turn power off. If you want the pump on, turn it on. If you dont trust it to automatically sense water, why would you want it in the boat?

Seems its an On or Off situation to me....but as I started out saying...maybe I dont understand?

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Good Point....

However, the automatic float can get stuck open or closed due to debris, fish scales, etc...
Therefore, the manual switch could be used for emergency use.

Also, a person may not want to pump out a live fishwell automatically. They may want to leave the fishwell full of water. In this case, the manual switch could be used to control the height of the water in the livewell.... If you put the pump on automatic, then the fishwell would empty of water and kill your bait fish....

Of course if you are using a bilge pump just in the sump area, then you wouldn't need a auto/manual switch on the console.
My Outrage 18' does not have a switch on the console. I have my Rule-Mate hooked directly to the battery with an inline fuse of the recommended size. My pump is always on automatic.
To turn it off, I have to remove or disassemble the inline fuse. This works OK but still a switch on the console is a good idea, then you could turn it off or use it manually should something happen to the automatic part of the system.

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The auto pumps I was referring to are the one with a separate float switch. Not the sensor type. I guess it boils down to what suits your needs or preference. I do believe the later whalers do not drain as well as the early ones. At least with the outrages. The olders ones (1970's. early 1980's) seemed much simpler. Whaler probably should have kept it that way.