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I've seen a lot of chat on this site about the new Etec and the praise its recieved. My only experience with an etec was on a 5m RIB equipped with a 90hp. Although I like the Etec concept and claims, I was surprised by how loud it was and it semed to lack low end power. Had I not known it was an Etec, I would have guessed it was a regular 2 stroke from the noise. It may have just been this unit, and not a fair representation of Etecs in general.

Yamaha makes a direct injection series (HPDI, i think) and I've seen only the 200hp and maybe thats the only model. Was blown away by how silent it ran, and the owner claimed the fuel consumption was drastically reduced from his previous 200hp 2 stroke.

Although comparing apples and oranges in HP, was wondering if anyone has had experience with the the Yamaha line of direct inject two strokes?

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I would not rate the E-Tec as noisy however, it is not as quite as other 4strokes. I have never been on a boat with a HPDI motor. The 90 E-Tec is an inline 3 cylinder and there has been some noise about the it not being as grunty as the old V4 motors. I would speculate the you will see the next evolution of the 90 built off the V4 platform of the 115 to get the grunt back.

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I was thinking E-Tec for repower, but after looking at Jack Harley's home page http://www.whalercentral.com/infusion...er_id=3648 and reading about his repower with just a 150 Yamaha 4 stroke, and hearing how great it's performing for him on a 22' (especially the reduced fuel consumption), I'm hesitating....

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Derwd24,

There is no way a 150hp is going to give you better fuel economy that a 200hp engine... Any brand of engine.

You will be pushing the exact same weight therefore the smaller 150hp engine is going to work much harder to push that weight than the 200hp engine.

You will get the same fuel economy but the 150hp will be running at much higher RPM's to maintain any give speed as opposed to a 200hp... The 150hp will wear out much faster as it is working much harder.... With a 200hp, you will be just loafing along and the engine will last much longer....

I had a 175hp on my 22' Cuddy and would have preferred a 200hp.....

My opinion and I'm sticking to it...

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Thanks Joe, I'm a little gunshy as the old engine was a real gas guzzler so if I invest in a new one, need it to be optimal.

I see your point though and was also concerned as I did run at capacity a number of times (the 22' handles 11 people amazingly well BTW, though some were kids) and would be really loading a 150 under those conditions.

I remember years ago when our old Johnson 150 quit and we were considering going to a 200 on our old ski runabout, the guy told us that the displacement was exactly the same on the two engines, but the carbs were different and the 200 was designed to deliver more fuel for more power, but at the price of economy. I thought this may be a similar scenario. But that was old technology too...

Was also thinking that maybe the HP rating of the new engines being taken at the shaft may be equicalent to a higher HP older engine?

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This is an interesting topic. Many factors come into play when comparing gas consumption in larger outboards. In Jason Harleys case he went from an older carbed 2 stroke to a new fuel injected 4 stroke. My bet would considerable savings fuel. He notes a 2/3 savings...

As far as comparing and older 150 to 200 I guess it would depend on the engine itself. Using old Merc as an example, for many years the basic 150 was the same engine as basic 200 with exception of carbs and jet. Used on the same boat, fuel economy would be identical. The difference would be a few MPH on the top end.

Dana, you and I are odd spots with engines. I would like to upgrade as well but only to something a bit beefier the 90 Yamie. (not that is weak, but that 17 ft hull can handle more) Not sure if we would gain anything with an etec, or 90 4 stroke. Those 4 stokes are additional 100 LBS plus monsters. A big deal in a 17...:o not so much on a 22 footer. Maybe a Merc 90 2 stroke because of added displacement but environmental issues now in many states may make that a problem. NJ for example will as tough as Ca. I am sure other state will follow.

Dana your question may be a good one for the Yamaha forum. I have noticed many HPDI posts on that forum. http://qs1272.pair.com/btsqs/bnetgrou...ay.php?f=2

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Good points Jon and pretty much the reason I went with the Yamaha 150 four stroke instead of another two stroke. Same engine weight, electronic fuel injection, two less cylinders, no oil mixed with gas; just better technology. I did lose 4 or 5 MPH on the top end due to the larger prop, but in my application, I rarely run over 35 MPH. Joe's point about wear on the engine could be valid. I do run higher RPMs to attain similar speeds of the older 200 Johnson. So far, I am very pleased with the performance of the Yamaha; especially the fuel economy. Most of my use, however, is spent trolling while bluewater fishing.

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Even if I bought a new boat today I would find a way to get an E-Tec on it or at least an other 2 stroke motor on the hull. 4 stroke outboards do not appeal to me. Though just slightly heavier, they do have same fuel economy as a new 2 stroke, cost more to purchase, cost more to maintain, they have a torque curve that pales next to a 2 stroke, and when the motor goes south you have 100's more moving parts to replace thanks to the need for a cylinder head with a valve train. Rebuilding or fixing a 4 stroke with major internal problems will cost way beyond that of a 2 stroke.

The thing most never look at when buying a motor is the dyno plots for a given motor. You should be looking at the torque output of an outboard over the hp rating as in boating the torque of a motor is much more important to the ability to put the boat on plane, turn the right props, and keep the boat up on plane.

Since a 2 stroke gives power output every 2nd cycle of a piston it will give more torque output than a 4 stroke which has 3 dead cycles and only give power every 4th cycle.

Also, I just love the sound of the two strokes pushing the boat long. Twin 2 strokes :D oh man.

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jon,

i'm not looking for a new motor for my 17, although i'd love to be able to hit 45kts, but i'll have to stay with my 90hp yam. when i was calling dealers about an engine for my 17' i talked with a dealer who happened to grow up with my father, so i'd like to think he was giving me the facts, without a lot of bull.

my whaler is a '68, so certinally not designed for the weight of a 4stroke. he told me if i wanted a 4stroke he WOULD NOT put on a 90hp, max 50-60hp due to weight. with the weight of a 90hp he said your transom would be too low in a following sea and the added weight of the motor would take away from top end. bottom line was he said your whaler is not designed for that weight... had i had a newer whaler he said no problem.

because i was using this boat to commute to work 8miles round trip, 6days a week i wanted decent fuel economy. he said the fuel savings you'll get from a 60hp 4 stroke will not be enough to make it worth it. becasue the boat is light, a larger 2 stroke will go faster and still get ok mpg.

long story short i got a 1991 yamaha 90hp with oil injection. engine had 200 original hrs and the price was right, enough left over to fill the boat with beer!

on 12 gallons i could make the round trip 6 times at almost WOT, with a little left in the tanks. seems decent, although i'd be curious to hear what others get with different motors. certinally better than our old evinrude 150hp on a 22' grady - that drinks gas.

i'm making a 60mile trip this weekend, and i'll try to remember to track my fuel use.

dana

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Dana,

45 knots will be a real tough one.... That may equate to 53+ MPH. Now 45 MPH may be do able... If you drain out all the beer B)

The 90 yamie is good match for the 17 hulls. Not bad fuel, but am comparing it to my old V6 merc. Your 68 is a slightly different design compared to the 80s and 90s version of the 17 footer. I think Delaware Dan has one like yours with a 115. I have seen many 17s with larger engines.

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jon,

i agree with what you say about design differences. And i think you are right about delewaredan having a similar hull. I'd guess with a 115hp he'd be able to see the low 50's mph, with my 90hp i clocked my fastest at 37-38kts on the gps... and i admit thats plenty fast, and only in nice glassy conditions.

however i'd like to know i had a little left... my friends have a 24' Regulator with twin 150 4strokes and i'd love to be able to just once pull up next to them smile and pull past!!! after that i'd never need the extra speed again.

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Yamaha has made HPDI models in sizes from 150 HP all the way to 300 HP. I believe their only HPDI offerings now are the 150, 175 (V-Max) and 200.

My personal experience with the E-Tec 90 on a 17 foot Whaler seems to be completely at odds with drantlett's. That motor was extraordinarily quiet compared to the number of two stroke motors I have run and owned over the years on 17 foot Whalers. The fuel economy was excellent as well but the most striking thing about the E-tec was its low end torque. It is as powerful upon acceleration as a much larger motor.

The one place it does not stand out is the top end. The Montauk this motor was on was not as fats as it would have been had it had a classic Johnson or Evinrude V-4 90. The E-Tec feels like a more powerful motor that has its throttle constrained.