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Regarding installation on my new to me OR 22. The towing eye sure is in the way of where I would like to place my 15 Suzuki. If I had a tie bar set up I could place it real close to the main engine and leave the tie bar connected all the time. I think I would like to have the tie bar, but not HAVE to have it connected. Sometimes it is advantagous to us the tiller arm.

I am thinking about removing the towing eye and replace with a stainless nut and washer. Comments and ideas would be appreciated.

Thanks,
Doug

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Doug,
Yes, many people have removed that eye. Some have even relocated the eye out of the way but still useable as a tie-down.

I did not have to remove my eye on my Outrage 18' but it was very close.
http://users.sisqtel.net/jkriz/Outrag...ge/Kicker/

I would do what you need to do in order to have the kicker the way you want it.

Good Luck,
Joe

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Joe,

I can have the kicker between the eye and the main engine, just like your set up.

Does the tie bar remain connnected at all times? If so, are conflicts with the engines through all tilt and swivel positions resolved? In other words, nothing hits each other or the boat while the kicker is tilted up and vice versa?

Thanks a lot,
Doug

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Doug,

I moved the stern eye on my 24 Outrage about 3 inches inboard to accomadate my kicker motor mount. After it was removed I filled the hole with an expoxied dowl plug and then gelcoated over the top. When complete you won't be able to tell a hole was ever there. I also use a tie bar set-up with dual binnacle controls forward. Look at my personal page it contains a good picture of kicker both inside and out. My personal page is titled "John K 24 Outrage".

Good Luck,

John

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Doug,

Mine stay connected all the time but it only takes 10 seconds to disconnect the tie bar if needed as they have quick disconnects.

I have full range of either engine up or down without any interference except for one exception.
When both engines are down, in a port turn, the two engine just barely touch, and I mean just barely. Other than that no problems at all. You do need to make sure you have enough clearance though. If I could move my kicker out 1/2 of an inch, then my engines would not hit at all in the port turn. I chose not to move, or remove, my lifting eye.

Joe

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John,

Nice boat! I like the clean installation of the new engines.

I have an aversion to drilling more holes in a transom, for some reason. I am a carpenter by trade, and have no qualms about cutting, drilling, sanding or whatever to whatever materials, I just have a hard time drilling more holes in my Whaler transoms! Structurally, I guess it does not matter if you drill another hole, especially if the former mounting hole is treated properly.

Joe,

I just moved the kicker into the slot between the main and the eye. The bracket on the front of the kicker hits the hydraulic brakcket on the main, even with the kicker hard against the eye. I guess its either remove the eye and replace with a nut, or move the eye bolt and patch the hole.

Thanks for the input guys,
Doug

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Here's the link aquaman (John) is telling us about above.

http://whalercentral.com/infusions/pe...ser_id=218

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Doug,

That eye was removed from my former Outrage Cuddy 22 when I bought her. There was no kicker - just a kicker mounting plate.

Looking back on the situation it seemed necessary to remove the eye and installation of a kicker was further complicated by the presence of trim tabs.

Here is a pic of the boat with the kicker mount that was installed by the previous owner:

[color=brown]Removed Dead Link[/color]

With the new mount and kicker:

[img]http://whalercentral.com/images/Kicker-1.jpg[/img]

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looks like your towing eye is in a different place than on the 1983 hull like my Revenge. I have found that it is best for me to remove the bar that hooks my main motor to the kicker when not in use for two reasons. My bar hook up broke where it hooks to the kicker and I think I was tourqing it a bit when I raised the kicker up. Reason 2, my kicker is on the port side and if the tiller arm falls down you can not turn very far to starboard, the arm hits the side of the boat. It was quite scary when I found that out. Pictures of my kicker set up are in the personal pages, Johns 1983 Revenge. John

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Thanks for the info guys. I removed the eye and replaced with a nut. The 15 is on the transom now. I will be be putting in a requistion for a steering tie bar kit soon.

Many, many years ago my brother in law and I made tie bars for our main to kicker steering. I can't remember where we bought the parts. We found sockets with spring loaded retainer sleeves that we mounted on bar stock that was threaded to accept the socket. The socket came with a ball that had a short threaded bolt at the base. We made brackets that attached to the front of the kicker steering bracket. I guess this is the same thing as the Panther steering kit?

The next project is the fuel for the kicker. Joe, I like the sound of the accumix system. It seems like this system could be used on other brands besides OMC. What do you think? Adaptable to my Suzuki 15? I would really like to not have a fuel tank on deck. I also don't want to buy a different kicker motor. If the Accumix system can be used with other brands, that would be just the ticket.

Thanks again all,
Doug

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Doug,

I believe the AccuMix can be used with almost all kickers.
Two things to make sure of.
1. The kicker runs on 50:1 mix
2. The fuel pump on the kicker is large enough to pull the mix. OMC calls this a High Capaciity fuel pump. I had to put the High Capactiy on my 8hp.

Here is the installation manual for the AccuMix:
http://whalercentral.com/readarticle....icle_id=26

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Joe,

I guess now the question is, does the Suzuki 15 have a fuel pump with enough capacity to pump the oil too? Hmmmm, I wonder where one might find this information.

I wonder how much suction is required and how much suction does this engine's fuel pump make? I have a little research ahead of me.

Any info or a direction to find the info would be appreciated.

Thanks,
Doug

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Doug,

When I bought my outrage last year the mounting plate for the kicker bracket was mounted where the starboard tow hook was. I personally would use the tow hook more than the kicker bracket so I removed it and put the tow hook back. However, you could remove the eyelets, put in a carriage bolt in from the water side of the transom to retain the eyelet in the splashwell and the put the kicker bracket over the carriage bolt.


Here is a image of the stern of my boat. The kicker bracket is off but the quick release plate is still on the stern..
[color=brown]Removed Dead Link[/color]

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Jeff,

I didn't think of using a carriage bolt. That would work really well. I just put a nut and washer on the threaded rod. The lifting eye remains in place. I tried to make it where I could remove the kicker, reinstall the towing eye and reinstall the swim platform. With all the parts available, it would not take very long to do.

Thanks for posting the picture of your boat, its a nice one!

Doug

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I stopped by the Suzuki shop on the way home from work tonight. I inquired as to if Suzuki ever manufactured a system similar to the Accumix R. I did not get anywhere with that crew, only what I call, "question mark eyes".

I need to determine at what vacuum the "high capacity" pump of the OMC system is rated. I could temporarily install a gauge in the fuel line ahead of the pump on the 15 Suzuki. I should be able to measure the vacuum and compare it to what the rated vacuum of the OMC high capacity pump. My theory is, if the Suzuki fuel pump produces at or above what the OMC high capacity pump generates, the OMC Accumix R system should perform as designed, on the Suzuki 15.

Does anyone have access to what the rated capacity of the OMC high capacity pump is? This is a tall order, I know. If someone with the Accumix R system has the ability and the time, would it be possible to check what vaccum the high capacity pump does produce and post it here? Again, I know it would be more work than most would want to take on and I would certainly understand. If anyone could check on this, I would certainly appreciate it.

Comments would be welcomed.
Thank you,
Doug Vazquez

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Next Summer will be season 2 for me with a 1985 Revenge 22. I would like to add a kicker this off season. Any thoughts on minimum size? Will a 9.9 do it or should I be looking at a 15? I boat in Buzzard's Bay, MASS
Tim Gibbs

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Tim,

I have not had enough experience with this boat/kicker set up yet to KNOW how well it will work. Most of my kick experience has been on a Montauk or Sakonnet. Both of those boats are very low windage boats. A 6 HP engine worked fine on those boats, until it got really windy.

My 22 OR has a T-top that will make handling in breezes a little more of a challenge than the Montauk/Sakonnet 6 HP combinations, even with the 15HP.

With your Revenge you have even more windage. This is just a guess on my part, but I think a 15 should be pretty close to a minimum for the 22 Revenge. Others with more experience with the Revenge hull may chime in soon. If not, start a thread specific to your hull and someone should weigh in on this.

Doug Vazquez

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There are several articles and discussions on the size of the kicker.
To begin with, Weight, Weight, and Weight... The weight needs to be considered.

An 8hp on a 22' seems to be fine for most people.
http://continuouswave.com/whaler/refe...icker.html
The above link utilizes the Electric start and Power Trim model Yamaha.

For people that don't want the weight and trouble of the Electric start and Power Trim, check this article out:
http://users.sisqtel.net/jkriz/Outrag...ge/Kicker/

Now, back to the weight.
If you were going to purchase a 9.9hp, then I would also look at the weight of the same model 15hp. Many times the weight of the 9.9 and the 15 are the same. In this case, I would choose the 15hp.

Here is a Quick Reference Guide to Kicker model choices and their weights.
http://www.whalercentral.com/articles...p?cat_id=4

Good Luck with your decision and let us know what you decide and how you like it.

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Tim, the Revenge will only do about 8 knots with the Evenrude 15 2-stroke, old smoky 2, that I have on my 1983 22' Revenge. That is enough poop to get you back in if you need to, and I hope it is enough poop to keep you put untill help arrives, never had to try it in the real nasty stuff. I think one of these new bigfoot type 4 strokes at 10 hp would be the ticket. One that can charge on it's own would be nice. I would run it on a seperate tank than the main, just for peace of mind. John

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I have decided on a 15 HP. We boat in Buzzard's Bay near the Cape Cod Canal Entrance, so current also factors into the equation. I'm thinking 4 stroke to allow direct connection to the main tank. Also linking the stearing. Remote throttle and shift would be nice, but not a neccessity.

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I have been busy the past couple of days on this little project. Its taken longer than it should have and I'm not quite done yet. Here's a couple of pictures of the progress so far. I still have to gussie up the brackets (radius the corners and brush out the stainless plate) and adjust the connector rod a little. The major part, the fabrication of the brackets and the engineering of the connector rod are pretty well whipped.

I used the Goldeneye steering kit, some 1/4" stainless plate and some heavy gauge sheet stainless both left over from a job of mine. I am more of a wood guy (carpenter by trade), so my metal working takes a little longer with the tools I have to work with. The 1/4" plate takes quite a bit of time to cut with a sawzall. Take a look...





Doug Vazquez

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Hmmm,

My guess on posting images was not a good guess. I will try to get them posted soon, if I can figure out how.

Doug

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Here is another attempt at posting pictures of the kicker connection.


http://photos.thedieselstop.com/showp...hoto=27542

http://photos.thedieselstop.com/showp...hoto=27541

Doug Vazquez

edited: 11/15
Sorry, guys, I am trying the url function so see if it will do what I think it will.
Doug

Hey, that worked! I will post the url to the finished piece.
Doug

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Doug,

The URL you are using doesn't really point to a particular photo.
It points to a website with ALL of your photos. I think that is why it isn't working.

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Here are the urls to the finished auxilliary steering connector:

http://photos.thedieselstop.com/showp...thecat=500

http://photos.thedieselstop.com/showp...thecat=500

Here are the pictures of the individual parts:

main engine bracket
http://photos.thedieselstop.com/showp...thecat=500

connector rod
http://photos.thedieselstop.com/showp...thecat=500

kicker motor bracket
http://photos.thedieselstop.com/showp...thecat=500

I'm a little embarrassed to say that I worked most of Saturday and Sunday on the rough in. Saturday was all for naught, the original design would work fine with both engines down, but tilting in all combinations was not possible. The hydraulic steering complicates the matter. Late Satuday was spent on redesign and relayout of the brackets.

Soooo, Sunday was spent on refabrication, Monday morning was spent on the finish work. A fun project.

Doug Vazquez

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Doug,

You could put all your photos in your Personal Page and then put a link to them here.
Like this:

[img]http://whalercentral.com/images/ppimages/306/658steering_connector06.jpg[/img]

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Ah hah!

Thanks Joe, I will remember that. I was trying to save the space on the personal page for nice pictures-like when I actually get the boat in the water, with a nice background or with me or a friend holding a big salmon.

I should have the new axles, brakes, and rollers on the trailer before the end of the week. Hopefully I can get some pictures uploaded to my personal page this Sunday.

Thanks again for the help,
Doug Vazquez

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Doug,

As you can see, the place where you have your photos does not allow photo linking.
I would change if I were you, but then, that might just be me...

Lots of other ways to do things. As Jeff mentioned above, you could make it an attachment.

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I would recomond photobucket for storage of images. Easy to use and they allow direct linking.

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Joe and Jeff,

I see what you mean about the hosting of images. I will check into photobucket. This is off topic, but I will try attaching an image from my hard drive right now.

Upon edit:

I guess I still don't understand how to do that.
Doug