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80lb Trolling Motor on 1986 Montauk?
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| Psiena |
Posted on 01/18/16 - 9:03 AM
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I am thinking of installing an 80lb ST class bow mount trolling motor from Minn Kota. I really would prefer the 70lb because its 20lbs lighter , but does not come in the ST class. I have bow rails and like the 55lb, 54 in, install of msd58 -- can see it on his Personal Page, and the bracket/puck mount pic below.
1) Would weight be too much for that install--?
2) Would that position tolerate well going to a 60in shaft length, vs a 54 in shaft length. Both are options.
I could settle back to the 70lb SP, but I do like the easy deploy and assist of the ST series, along with ability to order it with I-Pilot link.
Thoughts, experiences? (ps not interested in transom or engine mounts)
I fear without some deploy/stow assist getting the motor up and down will be a pain from that spot for an SP
Psiena attached the following image:
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Edited by Psiena on 01/18/16 - 9:08 AM |
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| bradsc |
Posted on 01/18/16 - 11:28 AM
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Why do you want an 80# trolling motor on a Montauk 17? You are going to have to get 24 volts. Either a very big battery or 2 batteries. I am not sure the weight difference between the trolling motors of a 80# vs. the 70# and 55#. An 80# will be a lot of weight on the bow of the boat. I can tell a difference on boat performance and handling when my 55 is on the bow and when it is not. Unless you are going to be pulling ballyhoo off shore you do not need 80#'s of thrust to move a Montauk.
We work the banks and up in creeks and the 55# can move the boat easily even against a strong tide. The one battery has never ran out of juice. The 54" shaft is plenty. My depth collar is set at 45" and I even pull the motor up by hand when we are in really shallow water. We also carry a 10' "stick-it" which is invaluable for inshore fishing. You may have a special situation but I think you will be adding a great deal of weight to the boat and will most likely be trolling around at minimum speed.
Edit- speling!!!!!!!!! :)
Edited by bradsc on 01/18/16 - 11:46 AM |
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| Psiena |
Posted on 01/18/16 - 12:43 PM
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Bradc--
Thanks so much for your reply, the info sounds reassuring for the 55lb class.
1) On the weight- this is a work in progres- s but I was comparing different thrust lbs using the Amazon specs and came up with a difference of 20lbs between a 70lb and an 80lb, then I saw the 55lb was the same as the 70lb. Well I went back to check just now, and I see actually the product weights are all over the place from one listing to the next, now making me doubt all that info. MKs site also seems useless for this too. So if someone has dealt with both weights, especially SP vs ST series that info is a factor..
2) I have no problem with the 55lb in itself, but wanted the efficiency of 24 volt, and the anchor locker would do fine for me to put the two batteries there. The 70lb would do that, and perhaps for not that much more weight, however does not come in the ST class which means no stow and deploy assist- which would have been a nice option. But ST adds weight and perhaps SP too.. Which class do you have
3) Also one other question- I fish from the back of the boat, by myself, with weight of 90hp e-tec, hence i-pilot. Do you think shaft length at 54" is still fine when the weight shifts to the rear lifting the bow?
Aside from back channels, I will use it in a choppy bay, and light winds in open ocean in 2-3 foot swells. Do not need high speed just energy efficient movement.
Edited by Psiena on 01/18/16 - 3:05 PM |
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| Psiena |
Posted on 01/18/16 - 1:27 PM
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Bradsc.. separately, just looked at your own install, looks great!.. Did you have to sacrifice the bow light for that?
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| PurrSeaStance |
Posted on 01/18/16 - 3:48 PM
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As other have noted 55# is plenty enough. Your comment asking about sacrificing the bow light is a bit scary, frankly. You do know that you'll need to run the dedicated and correct HEAVY GAUGE wires from your trolling motor battery (hopefully fused or circuit breaker protected) right?
The iPilot on the MinnKotas is awesome so I would recommend that no matter the #s thrust. The Anchor feature is very useful for fishing kelp out here in San Diego. Love the remote control when I'm fishing solo. Easy to deploy and retrieve. PM me if you need any help.
Wishin I was fishin! |
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| bradsc |
Posted on 01/18/16 - 4:16 PM
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Unfortunately I did have to sacrifice the bow light. I put LED's on the side of the console. I had some experience with a small bass boat and discovered then how important it is to me to have the trolling motor pulling from the center of the boat. There are many ways to mount one though. I have the 55 ST 54" with the co-pilot which I wear on my wrist and often steer from all over the boat. I do not have any experience with the i-pilot.
So you are thinking of putting 2 batteries in the anchor locker. I just do not know if that will be to much weight in front of the boat. I have taken waves over the bow several times and only had an anchor up front. If you are fishing from the bow, 2 batteries, and the trolling motor itself.... just seems like a lot of weight up front. Maybe try to figure out the total weight and put sand bags up front and see how the boats sits and rides. I just cut a new hole in the console floor and keep the deep cycle battery in the console. You could do that and get a deep cycle battery and a dual purpose battery with a battery switch. Just do not run down the starting/deep cycle battery too low. You would loose the 24 volt. If you plan to troll pretty fast and for many hours you may need the 24 volt. I would try to find a way to get all that weight centered in the boat.
I still have about 7" that I could lower the 54" shaft. The top of the propeller sits about 8" under water. I do this on purpose so if we get too shallow and the trolling motor hits bottom, I can grab the head and pull the motor up by hand and back up. The motor sits deeper than the boat so we would not get stuck especially at low tide. You only do that once! I have had 2 people in the back of the boat trying to land a fish and the trolling motor was still in the water. Maybe see if someone can help you with a yard stick and move from the front to the back and see how much the bow will rise. I would think it will be 3-4". I think the 54" will give you plenty of length. Just double check.
EDIT: I went out to the garage and my 55 is the ST. I think it is about 10 years old. These things are built to last!
Edited by bradsc on 01/18/16 - 7:04 PM |
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| Psiena |
Posted on 01/18/16 - 7:22 PM
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PurrSeaStance wrote:
As other have noted 55# is plenty enough. Your comment asking about sacrificing the bow light is a bit scary, frankly. You do know that you'll need to run the dedicated and correct HEAVY GAUGE wires from your trolling motor battery (hopefully fused or circuit breaker protected) right?
The iPilot on the MinnKotas is awesome so I would recommend that no matter the #s thrust. The Anchor feature is very useful for fishing kelp out here in San Diego. Love the remote control when I'm fishing solo. Easy to deploy and retrieve. PM me if you need any help.
Thanks, but re: the cabling, not to worry- I was referring to Bradsc's install- his mount runs dead center, right over top where the bow light would be (cfr. his personal page).
-I have a transom motor setup already, fused up- 50 amp- and all, with a 2nd battery in the console. It ofcourse just does not cut it for me. You are right, i-pilot, or i-pilot link on the bow is the direction I am moving in for sure,
Edited by Psiena on 01/18/16 - 7:59 PM |
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| bradsc |
Posted on 01/18/16 - 7:25 PM
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I was typing when purrsea posted.
I had 6-AWG silver coated wire that led to a 50 amp circuit breaker on the positive side. And right to the battery on negative. This was a pain when you wanted to take off the trolling motor. I now have a Minn Kota MKR -18 plug and receptacle using 8 AWG silver coated wire. Used the 50 amp circuit breaker between the battery and the receptacle. This is much easier taking the trolling motor off and putting it back on.
Speling agin!!
Edited by bradsc on 01/18/16 - 7:26 PM |
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| Psiena |
Posted on 01/18/16 - 7:56 PM
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bradsc wrote:
So you are thinking of putting 2 batteries in the anchor locker. I just do not know if that will be to much weight in front of the boat. I have taken waves over the bow several times and only had an anchor up front. If you are fishing from the bow, 2 batteries, and the trolling motor itself.... just seems like a lot of weight up front. Maybe try to figure out the total weight and put sand bags up front and see how the boats sits and rides. I just cut a new hole in the console floor and keep the deep cycle battery in the console. You could do that and get a deep cycle battery and a dual purpose battery with a battery switch. Just do not run down the starting/deep cycle battery too low. You would loose the 24 volt. If you plan to troll pretty fast and for many hours you may need the 24 volt. I would try to find a way to get all that weight centered in the boat.
Good info , and thanks.
The 54 inch at any rate I think will have to do, given increased overhang for the 60 in when stowed.
Well two factors are in play here regarding weight-- the 90hp etec I put on added about 80lbs of weight to the stern over the old 2 stroke. That should give me a little more play up front regarding balance. But a test is a good idea.
I like the idea of the 24v, simply because it is more efficient, especially with a lead acid battery setup- read how much more battery life one get, but the 55lb class has the ST stow assist, that SP does not. Not sure how much of a pain the 70lb will be to manually lift, bending my body over/around the bow rail.
Less serious consideration, is I am trying to be forward looking knowing how these motors last, and time will come when all of us are going to be buying lithium ion or equivalent batteries that will weigh about half of what we have now, and with out the amp draw losses you get with lead. Right now what I want there is in the $1000 range, but maybe another 5 years could be in $250 range. Tesla is building Li-on batteries at 1/4 of current market price per k/wt- just a matter of time before the sweet spot on price comes.
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| bradsc |
Posted on 01/19/16 - 1:45 PM
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Good point on battery technology! It will be only a matter of time. Good luck on your install.
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| Whalerbob |
Posted on 01/19/16 - 6:33 PM
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Random input FWIW...
I have a 55# on the bow of my Montauk and it's plenty of power for lake and light ocean/bay use.
If you're concerned about length it's east to cut the shaft to the size you want.
The wiring you describe and batteries in the anchor locker sound complicated and problematic. I have two group 27 AGM's in the console with a length of wire connected to my AB switch. When I'm using the motor I connect with a quick connect, when I'm not the wire stays coiled up in the console. It's not optimal since the wire lays on deck but it's simple and works.
The two group 27's provide me with enough power to run the motor, fish finder, bait well, etc all day. I rarely exhaust even one battery in a normal day of fishing but I keep a small jumper box in the console when I know I'm going to push the limits.
The added weight you're talking about for the bigger motor is probably negligible but with two guys standing on the bow of my boat and a full cooler the bow sits low. You should expect to take a wave once in a while and my anchor locker partially fills with water when I'm standing up there so your batteries and connections will be wet. The bigger concern is where will you keep your anchor?
Edited by Whalerbob on 01/19/16 - 6:43 PM |
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| Psiena |
Posted on 01/19/16 - 9:19 PM
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Whalerbob wrote:
The added weight you're talking about for the bigger motor is probably negligible but with two guys standing on the bow of my boat and a full cooler the bow sits low. You should expect to take a wave once in a while and my anchor locker partially fills with water when I'm standing up there so your batteries and connections will be wet. The bigger concern is where will you keep your anchor?
Truth be told, I think I am drifting back to the 55lb, mainly because the ST seems to have some pluses over the SP. I currently use a 24 DC for trolling , 80 ah., under the console. The bow will have 50+ added pounds already with the motor itself so I guess I would be pushing it.
I plugged up the anchor locker drain through the hull, and will make that permanent some time soon. I have a drain tube in from the locker to deck side.
I know I can fit one anchor over a battery if the situation called for it, but as it is, the console position looks good right now. If the next gen of batteries ever gets here- that is on price- , then I could back a lot of power in that space- 30lbs of Li-on battery would blow SLA world away , and amp draw accelerated losses in peak power would not happen like it does with lead acid.
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| Whalerbob |
Posted on 01/20/16 - 5:59 AM
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Psiena wrote:
I plugged up the anchor locker drain through the hull, and will make that permanent some time soon. I have a drain tube in from the locker to deck side.
This is an interesting idea, thanks. There's no reason the anchor and rode should need to take a salt water bath every time I use the boat. In my locker there's a small depression at the bottom where the existing through-hole is, is that where you cut the new drain?
I'd be interested to know if there are any major complications associated with this mod and please post some pics when you have a chance.
Edited by Whalerbob on 01/20/16 - 6:06 AM |
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| Psiena |
Posted on 01/20/16 - 7:10 AM
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Whalerbob wrote:
This is an interesting idea, thanks. There's no reason the anchor and rode should need to take a salt water bath every time I use the boat. In my locker there's a small depression at the bottom where the existing through-hole is, is that where you cut the new drain?
I'd be interested to know if there are any major complications associated with this mod and please post some pics when you have a chance.
Here is one discussion on the matter of the anchor locker drain- http://www.whalercentral.com/forum/vi...d_id=11419 with the purist wanting to leave it all alone. It is the perennial issue with improving things on a classic boat, and its tough to strike the balance. Facing it now with installing the trolling motor too.
I put my drain dead center, for looks, at the bottom of the locker, comes out the other side a few inches from the deck floor, using the standard bronze tubing. Info on that process is found by 'remove and replace of drain tube' searches. I will fill that depression at corner of the locker when I seal that old hull drain hole for good. If one wants to preserve the look you can just leave a drain plug in it. It terms of net result, worked out great for me, according to expectations.
This fella has all the pics you want on the same mod- http://s1177.photobucket.com/user/dui...6&o=10
Edited by Psiena on 01/20/16 - 8:02 AM |
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| BDBinWV |
Posted on 01/20/16 - 9:54 AM
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This past summer I installed a 80 lb MinnKota with I-pilot link and absolutely love it. I have two group 27 batteries in the console along with a dedicated group 24 starting battery. I spent a week on Lake Ontario trolling for salmon this past fall with two people on board and did not perceive any issues regarding weight distribution. It seems to be a great setup as far as I am concerned. Also the 54" shaft is more than sufficient.
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| Whalerbob |
Posted on 01/20/16 - 10:51 AM
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Thanks Psiena and good luck with your new motor. I have a Yeti 105 cooler on mine so when I fish the lakes with the electric I put it up on that bow platform and it makes a great seat that I can even stand on.
My only issue with changing the drain is the compartment won't drain completely if the hole isn't positioned in that existing depression. I keep it in my garage so I'm not concerned with rain water collecting but I already sponge the excess water out of the sump area before I put it away (yea, I baby it...), just trying to minimize that kind of thing.
If only there was a good way to use the existing hole at the bottom but route the drain tube through that bulkhead onto the deck I'd probably go for it. I have had good success bonding PVC to fiberglass so I could probably bend a tube and make it work but I tend to procrastinate this kind of thing if I don't have a clear vision of how I'll make it work.
Edited by Whalerbob on 01/20/16 - 1:09 PM |
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