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twin outboards
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| WhalerDan |
Posted on 12/09/09 - 1:41 PM
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Yes he did. Then he sold his 18 and got about 14.5K -- which I found very surprising. I'd be curious to know how the guy that bought his 70's did. One 70 was blown, then he got a third for 1K, and sold all 3 plus binnacle, control cables, older style analog gauges, etc. to someone for about 3.8K without shipping. I think the 2 original motors had over 800 hours, but I could be wrong. The hull had bottom repairs on keel, one area I was told leaked water prior to patching. The tank had not been replaced. The trailer had some issues.
Eggerity, I have a 1990 with twin 70's -- all in 9 condition. This configuration is very hard to find, especially in good condition. My motors have 350 or so hours.
Edited by WhalerDan on 12/09/09 - 1:45 PM |
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| egerrity |
Posted on 12/10/09 - 5:38 AM
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Dan, Thanks for the response. Now I remember seeing pics of that boat when he took possession of it. I realize that it will be hard to find an 18 with twins, but its worth the wait. Dan, you certainly got rewarded for your patients. After seeing the pictures of your NYC run and how nice your boat is I decided to stepup the search. I have been scanning Craigslist. Does anyone have any other suggestions, or know of a boat? It seems like having twins on that boat would really be a novelity, not to mention the safety and head turning factor. With regards to maneuvering, will it turn in its own space when split shifted? I would imagine that might be difficult with the engines being so close together. Thanks All!!
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| WhalerDan |
Posted on 12/10/09 - 6:20 AM
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Egerrity, try this site http://www.crazedlist.org/.
I think the first priority is to find a good clean 18 at a reasonable price. Twins are cool, but not necessary.
Yes, the boat will pretty much turn in its own space when split shifted. The motors are close together, but not that close. I do like the way two motors push my boat. Also if you have people on the boat you can use the trim/tilt to balance the weight.
Twins are loud. The new Yamaha 70 coming out looks like the dream motors for someone with twins. Similar weight.
I missed out on an 18 with a 150 OX66 Yamaha a mile from my house prior to getting my boat. That was a nice boat! And that's quite an engine. The guy selling the boat wouldn't take my money because he had promised some dude he'd never met he's hold the boat for him. The dude was in his 70's and passed on it, and was never serious. I argued I called his first, and he responded that because my cellphone had a 917 area code he thought I was far away and didn't get back to me. Very frustrating. Then I saw the guy who bought the boat in my local harbor, and he had a drop-dead gorgeous girlfriend. All I could do was laugh. Life's funny.
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| HarleyFXDL |
Posted on 12/10/09 - 11:05 AM
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Egerrity, I to had been looking for an 18' outrage with twins for some time. One member on this site has the cleanest one I have ever seen but he is not selling. It might be easier to find a hull without power and set it up your way than find a boat with twins.
Kevin
1988 11' Super Sport, 1987 Johnson 15hp.
If you think education is expensive, try ignorance
"Vegetarian - old Indian word for bad fisherman." |
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| littleblue |
Posted on 12/10/09 - 12:50 PM
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I think the lower hp motors not offering a counter-rotating option hurts the performance...You others w/ twins on an 18, are you using hydraulic steering or NFB systems? I have the original dual cable system and no matter where I adjust the trip fins on the motors, there is always some torque steer in some level of the trim range. Pain in the ass.
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| Abbie Prince |
Posted on 12/10/09 - 2:26 PM
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As you know I don't have twins, yet; but the dealers I have contacted looking for motors said I would experience the samething you have posted unless I put hydraulic on.
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| HarleyFXDL |
Posted on 12/10/09 - 3:25 PM
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I just purchased the seastar system for my boat. I'm waiting till I lift the deck up to replace the tank to install. Hopefully I will have the boat up and running for the next whaler run. I will let you guys know my opinion on hydraulic steering.
Kevin
1988 11' Super Sport, 1987 Johnson 15hp.
If you think education is expensive, try ignorance
"Vegetarian - old Indian word for bad fisherman." |
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| Finnegan |
Posted on 12/10/09 - 5:12 PM
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Regarding steering on a twin engine 18 Outrage, after three years I got rid of the Teleflex twin cable setup that came from the factory on mine. I installed the Sea Star I with Side mount cylinder mounted between the engines, and it was a HUGE improvment. No steering torque at all. JimH wrote a nice article on the installation for CW, featuring my boat, with detailed information on the mechanics of the steering setup.
http://continuouswave.com/whaler/refe...acket.html
Here is a photo of the steering with newly installed Merc 90's.
http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v42...G_0454.jpg
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| Josey Whaler |
Posted on 12/10/09 - 6:17 PM
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The only problem with a side mount steering cylinder mounted between twin engines likely means removing an engine to service/replace a cylinder. At least that has been my experience with twin Yamahas
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| Finnegan |
Posted on 12/10/09 - 6:23 PM
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No. Using Boston Whaler's recommended engine centerline spacing of 29-3/4", the steering cylinder can be installed or removed without removing an engine. The ram that actuates the link arm has a pin which allows the extension ram to be detached.
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| Josey Whaler |
Posted on 12/10/09 - 7:58 PM
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I am inclined to use the engine manufacturer mounting guidelines, which in the case of Yamaha is 26" OC. With larger V-6 engines, a cylinder swap is not possible. It seems using a wider mounting arrangement with smaller (narrower) engines provides the necessary clearance. In this case, adequate clearance may exist, but it is something that needs to be planned in the engine installation. On the 70 HP Yamaha's, the minimum centerline installation is 23 1/2", which would likely be too narrow for cylinder removal.
Edited by Josey Whaler on 12/10/09 - 8:10 PM |
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| number9 |
Posted on 12/10/09 - 10:03 PM
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The engine manufacturer mounting guidelines for mounting twins is provided as a minimum distance between motors to prevent interference. Whaler's recommendation will provide a bit of improvement in lateral stability and maneuverability.
Bill...On the Ogeechee
1984 Outrage 18...Yamaha T50...that's right, 50hp |
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| WhalerDan |
Posted on 12/11/09 - 6:43 AM
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I have the original Teleflex. It can be a bit stiff, but works very well. If I let go of the wheel the boat stays on a very straight course. I don't know if there is more reliability with my set-up or hydraulic.
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| egerrity |
Posted on 12/11/09 - 8:22 AM
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Thanks for the info guys. looks like my montauk will go on the market after the new year to clear way for an 18. Or should I put the cart before the horse?
How much are those new 70 Yammys going for ?
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| Josey Whaler |
Posted on 12/11/09 - 8:50 AM
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New retail on 2010 F70 is $8,745. I would expect that negotiated prices would be less. I have heard of some quoted prices less than $7,000.
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| Finnegan |
Posted on 12/11/09 - 11:24 AM
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When installing twin outboards, any HP, on any boat, the engine manufacturer's recommendation do not apply, except perhaps as a MINIMUM dimension, and that Teleflex hydraulic steering cannot be used in either side mount or front mount less than 26" centerlines.
It is the design of the boat that determines spacing, based on engine shaft length and hull/transom bottom configuration.
And for an 18 Outrage, Boston Whaler installed a transom sticker indicating a spacing of 29-2/4".
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| Whaler27 |
Posted on 12/13/09 - 3:36 AM
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egerrity wrote:
Thanks for the info guys. looks like my montauk will go on the market after the new year to clear way for an 18. Or should I put the cart before the horse?
How much are those new 70 Yammys going for ?
I'd think long and hard before putting a pair of new Yamaha F70s on the transom of an Outrage 18. You'll have over 520 lbs on the transom for 140 HP (Compare to about 410 lbs for a Suzuki 140 or 405 for a Evinrude E-TEC 130). The boat will be very stern heavy and it's quite likely that the rear splash well will always be full of water at rest even with the batteries moved to the console, robbing the console of some of the little storage space it has.
While the twin outboard factor is cool, unless you are going places that a tow service doesn't serve, there is little reason to have twin outboards on an 18 foot boat these days.
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| WhalerDan |
Posted on 12/13/09 - 7:19 AM
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Regarding weight, many people with single motors add a kicker motor. This would put the transom at the same weight as the twin Yams.
I have my batteries in the console. I cut a hole in the console floor so the batteries rest in boxes on the deck. This minimized the storage space. I like this set up very much.
Luckily my 70 Yams have about 360 hours and are in great shape. However, if I had the money and the need, those new Yam 70's providing their as good as Yam says....
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| HarleyFXDL |
Posted on 12/13/09 - 8:36 AM
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My Johnson 150 2S weighs 397 lbs and my kicker weighs 110 lbs for a total of 507 lbs. That is a lot of weight for a 150 hp (kicker does not add to the total HP). I looked at two new Yamaha 90 hp 2S engines for a total combined weight of 522 lbs. Almost the same weight but 180 hp total and a better power to weight ratio.
Kevin
1988 11' Super Sport, 1987 Johnson 15hp.
If you think education is expensive, try ignorance
"Vegetarian - old Indian word for bad fisherman." |
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| egerrity |
Posted on 12/13/09 - 10:54 AM
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All great info, and food for thought. I guess this will all depend on what boat surfaces. If a really clean 18OR with a single engine comes available it will be a no brainer. Even if the motor is tired, I would repower with a single. I dont think I would convert a single engine boat to twins. Then the question would be what to repower with. I have a soft spot in my heart for an ETEC... We will see....
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